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So What, If Any Protection Should Be Afforded To Pamela Geller?


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So do you think the best course of action is to sit idly by while they kidnap and murder people, American citizens included?

We need to stop pretending that we can end sectarian and tribal violence around the world. We also need to end the fallacy of thinking that we can just install western style democracies in places that have absolutely no historical reference for them. Iraq has always been divided strongly by tribal lines. No one has any Iraqi nationalism to speak of.

We could go in there and wipe out ISIS but it will only mean another radical group will take their place. We can't fix this with more war.

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We need to stop pretending that we can end sectarian and tribal violence around the world. We also need to end the fallacy of thinking that we can just install western style democracies in places that have absolutely no historical reference for them. Iraq has always been divided strongly by tribal lines. No one has any Iraqi nationalism to speak of.

We could go in there and wipe out ISIS but it will only mean another radical group will take their place. We can't fix this with more war.

One of the options that gets almost zero support is to actually consider a dialogue with some of these groups to see if they could be deradicalized. Probably not possible with ISIS - for them terrorism is a calculated strategy. But for other terrorist groups, figure out what they ultimately want and use diplomacy to get that for them. Once they deradicalize and become part of governing (which might require dividing up some countries so conflicting groups have their own states), they will have an incentive to fight against the radical groups that cannot be brought into the governing system.

But any politician who proposes that would be immediately attacked as "cozying up with terrorists".

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We need to stop pretending that we can end sectarian and tribal violence around the world. We also need to end the fallacy of thinking that we can just install western style democracies in places that have absolutely no historical reference for them. Iraq has always been divided strongly by tribal lines. No one has any Iraqi nationalism to speak of.

We could go in there and wipe out ISIS but it will only mean another radical group will take their place. We can't fix this with more war.

So you do think that doing nothing is the right tact, or you don't?

I agree with your post.

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So you do think that doing nothing is the right tact, or you don't?

I agree with your post.

I certainly don't support more invasions or other tactics that have proven to be only contributing to the problem. By all means let's protect the homeland but further military action in Iraq is pure lunacy.

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Maybe the US should stop being the Saoudis and Qataris little sweetheart and start keeping in check the multiplication of salafist schools that these SOBs are building all over the world...

The Saudis are definitely not our friends. Becoming more energy independent will be the best move we can make in regards to our national security.

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I certainly don't support more invasions or other tactics that have proven to be only contributing to the problem. By all means let's protect the homeland but further military action in Iraq is pure lunacy.

So when a group kidnaps and murders American citizens, we should not retaliate with violence?

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Does invading them again or doubling up on the bombing have any possible long-term effect on the region other than lengthening the time that it would take for the region to stabilize without interference and increasing the number of people that wish to take action against the U.S.?

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I'm not sure what you're getting at. Are you talking about here or abroad? There is a big distinction between protecting the homeland and expanding military actions abroad.

Abroad. If a group kidnaps and beheads American citizens on foreign soil, we should not retaliate with violence?

I'm just trying to point out that if we change course with regard to Middle East relations in the manner you suggest, that seems to involve sitting idly by while Americans are killed (not that that's any worse than other people being killed, it just gets us involved in a different way). I think that's the most unpalatable part of your proposed action.

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Abroad. If a group kidnaps and beheads American citizens on foreign soil, we should not retaliate with violence?

I'm just trying to point out that if we change course with regard to Middle East relations in the manner you suggest, that seems to involve sitting idly by while Americans are killed (not that that's any worse than other people being killed, it just gets us involved in a different way). I think that's the most unpalatable part of your proposed action.

Americans being kidnapped and beheaded has been going on for a while now. What have we been doing about it up to now that's made any difference? The vast majority of Americans captured or killed have been there due to our military involvement. In my view, the best way to get them to stop killing Americans is to stop giving them Americans to kill.
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Americans being kidnapped and beheaded has been going on for a while now. What have we been doing about it up to now that's made any difference? The vast majority of Americans captured or killed have been there due to our military involvement. In my view, the best way to get them to stop killing Americans is to stop giving them Americans to kill.

I think inaction in the face of such violence is a pretty difficult sell.

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Sure, I agree with that.

But say Isis attacks a US Embassy, or private US citizens, etc. abroad. We're going to just sit there and say 'We can't fix the long term problem with violence, so we're not going to do anything'?

Because that's the logical extension of your proposed policy.

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Sure, I agree with that.

But say Isis attacks a US Embassy, or private US citizens, etc. abroad. We're going to just sit there and say 'We can't fix the long term problem with violence, so we're not going to do anything'?

Because that's the logical extension of your proposed policy.

In my view, the only active measure we could take that would have any effect is to invade Iraq again and destroy ISIS. That would solve the immediate issue of ISIS, but it would be disastrous in the long run.

It sucks, but that's the predicament as I see it.

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Americans being kidnapped and beheaded has been going on for a while now. What have we been doing about it up to now that's made any difference? The vast majority of Americans captured or killed have been there due to our military involvement. In my view, the best way to get them to stop killing Americans is to stop giving them Americans to kill.

Where pray tell did you get that idea?

James Foley, 40 -- Foley was an American journalist working for an online news site GlobalPost and went missing near the Syria-Turkey border in November 2012. He grew up in New Hampshire and became a teacher for the Teach for America program before deciding to pursue journalism. After graduating from Northwestern University's Medill School of Journalism, he began his career as a war reporter. In a video interview with the Boston Globe, Foley discussed why he thought reporting in areas of war was essential.

Steven Sotloff, 31 -- Sotloff was the second U.S. journalist killed by ISIS, in September 2014. He was a freelance journalist who wrote for many publications such as theChristian Science Monitor and Time. Both a U.S and Israeli citizen, Sotloff had a strong interest in the Middle East. He studied Arabic in Yemen and reported in countries such as Egypt, Libya, and Syria. His work strived to show personal stories of people affected within areas of conflict.

Peter Kassig, 26 -- Kassig was a former U.S. Army Ranger serving in Iraq in 2007. He traveled to Lebanon a few years after his tour wanting to learn more about the Middle East. Kassig started SERA, Special Emergency Response and Assistance which gave Syrian refugees supplies such as propane fuel tanks and food, among other items. Kassig was killed in November 2014 in another graphic beheading by ISIS.

Kayla Mueller, 26-- Mueller was an Arizona native and dedicated her life to serving others. Her love of helping people started out at a young age when she volunteered for the Save Darfur Coalition as a teenager. Once Mueller graduated from Northern Arizona University, she began working as a humanitarian aid worker traveling across the world. In December 2012, she moved to the Turkish-Syrian border and began working with the Danish Refugee Council and the "Support to Life" humanitarian aid organization to help Syrian refugees. Mueller was taken hostage in August 2013 after leaving a Doctors Without Borders clinic in Aleppo, Syria.

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The mountain climbing pic is still on page 3. Snake's a lot of things, but I'm not sure he's a snitch. Now on the other hand if you post a pic of Steve, he'll definitely report it. I guess seeing what he actually looks like ruins his whole "I'm the same height and weight as Andre Johnson, and I can kill a cheetah with my bare hands" persona.

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