Why Did Grady Jarrett Fall To The 5Th Round?

[THE ICEMAN]

When you stack his numbers up against some smaller DTs in the past few drafts seems like he was a lock to got late 1st to early 3rd yet he fell all the way to the 5th.

While i do think he's perfect to play the NT in Quinns defense and may even send soliai and Jackson to the bench as neither really fit quinns scheme as he really stresses speed and athleticism which neither soliai or jackson have and Hageman will be the 3 tec in quinns defense who can play with speed or power and could probably play any of the DL roles besides the leo.

players with similar athleticism to jarrett is Aaron donald,Geno Adtkins,Sheldon Richardson and probably more but those three really stand out Jarrett actually had a higher grade than Donald per nfl he was at a 5.75 were donald was at 5.35 which according to the nfl ranking system is pretty accurate believe or not if you go back and look at some of them like Julio jones is in between perinal pro bowler and once in a life time prospect. Jarrett graded out to be chance to become nfl starter. they also had trufant at 8.4 which on there scale came out to perennial all pro which he is on the way to becoming just like jones has.

I also think Jarrett like Hageman (who seems to have gotten in much better shape) could get in much better shape and be get down to that 290ish range become stronger and faster and more versatile in quinns defense which having multiple guys who can play inside or out helps the defense become harder to stop as offensive lines just don't have those type of athletes up and down the line maybe at tackle but not inside and thats why richardson,donald and adtkins have been so effective its because they can play with speed and power and the center and guards just can't stop them on one on ones.

half the DL could look like Beasly,Hageman and jarrett if they all becomes good pass rushers it makes it near impossible to double them and the person they likely double would be jarrett as he would be over the center and no qb wants a qb wants pressure right up the middle.

i also think quinns defense can be a little different that seattles as he built that defense with the players they had for example they had good pass rushers but none project to be the pass rusher beasley project to be. he also never had a DLmen like hageman either throw in a guy like jarrett who can probably play the 3 tec as well it could be a little different.

All in all i guess jarrett fell because of his 6-1 stature but considering Aaron Donald is the raining rookie defensive player of the year would think Jarrett would have gone no later than early third.

[Romfal]

he is not a NT, he is a 1 gap penetrator or 3 tech. He fell because his skill set fits best with a scheme like ours.

[I MUS WRITE]

I don't think he fell four rounds because of scheme fit.

[Truth B Told (TRU)]

Because he didn't blow up at the combine, but neither did Geno Atkins nor Sen'derrick Marks. Look at Sen'Derrick production ever since he went to J-villle to play for Gus Bradley.

[THE ICEMAN]

he is not a NT, he is a 1 gap penetrator or 3 tech. He fell because his skill set fits best with a scheme like ours.

in quinns scheme the 1 gapper is the NT like mebane fore seattle

jarretts best fit is probably a 3 tec but i'm not sure he's the talent Hageman is who will play the three tec

[Romfal]

I don't think he fell four rounds because of scheme fit.

I'm not going to look up exact numbers, but lets say half the NFL runs a 3-4 defense. He is off the board for those teams because he is not a 2 gap player or a 0 tech Nose. Out of the 4-3 teams some run an over under, like us, with a NT(1 tech) whos job is to take on double teams from the Center and RG, freeing up the other DT(3 tech) to go 1 v 1 with the LG. Other 4-3 formations are the even, where both DT's(2 tech) line up over the respective guards. Lets say about half the teams ran each variation, that leaves 8 teams. Now some of these teams dont have a need at that position, combined with a limited number of picks and thats how a good player can drop to the 5th, when he is a scheme fit.

Also lets dismiss this "Grady can play NT" because he doesnt have the frame to take on two linemen, nor is it his strength.

[THE ICEMAN]

he is not a NT, he is a 1 gap penetrator or 3 tech. He fell because his skill set fits best with a scheme like ours.

this was from another topic were pete carrol explains his defensive roles

On the "One-Technique" Nose Guard: "The nose tackle plays in the A gap to the tight end side of the field in our defense. We have done a number of things with this position based upon the opposition at times. We have put him right in the A gap, we have cocked him on the center at times, and as needed we have even played him in a direct shade technique right over the center at times. The way we play him on base defense is as an inside-foot to outside-foot alignment or a 1 technique on the center to the strong side of the alignment."

"At Nose Tackle you have to find a player who likes to mix it up. We want a big guy in there who likes to get down and dirty. He is going to get doubled a lot on the run and pass and is going to get down blocked a lot. He has to be a tough player. This guy can be a short and stubby type of player."

jarrett fits that role pretty well but his best pos may be the three tec i can see jarrett moving along the DL a lot and using his skill set

[Romfal]

in quinns scheme the 1 gapper is the NT like mebane fore seattle

jarretts best fit is probably a 3 tec but i'm not sure he's the talent Hageman is who will play the three tec

in base, the NT is always a 2 gap, double team commanding player.

In sub defense( say 2nd and 13) you can line up with two players as a 3 tech and you might see Mebane rush there. Keep in mind most nfl teams play in the base defense 30-40% of the time.

[Romfal]

this was from another topic were pete carrol explains his defensive roles

On the "One-Technique" Nose Guard: "The nose tackle plays in the A gap to the tight end side of the field in our defense. We have done a number of things with this position based upon the opposition at times. We have put him right in the A gap, we have cocked him on the center at times, and as needed we have even played him in a direct shade technique right over the center at times. The way we play him on base defense is as an inside-foot to outside-foot alignment or a 1 technique on the center to the strong side of the alignment."

"At Nose Tackle you have to find a player who likes to mix it up. We want a big guy in there who likes to get down and dirty. He is going to get doubled a lot on the run and pass and is going to get down blocked a lot. He has to be a tough player. This guy can be a short and stubby type of player."

jarrett fits that role pretty well but his best pos may be the three tec i can see jarrett moving along the DL a lot and using his skill set

I bolded exactly why Grady Jarrett is not a nose in this scheme. Up to you if you want to listen or not.

[THE ICEMAN]

I'm not going to look up exact numbers, but lets say half the NFL runs a 3-4 defense. He is off the board for those teams because he is not a 2 gap player or a 0 tech Nose. Out of the 4-3 teams some run an over under, like us, with a NT(1 tech) whos job is to take on double teams from the Center and RG, freeing up the other DT(3 tech) to go 1 v 1 with the LG. Other 4-3 formations are the even, where both DT's(2 tech) line up over the respective guards. Lets say about half the teams ran each variation, that leaves 8 teams. Now some of these teams dont have a need at that position, combined with a limited number of picks and thats how a good player can drop to the 5th, when he is a scheme fit.

Also lets dismiss this "Grady can play NT" because he doesnt have the frame to take on two linemen, nor is it his strength.

no he's really a undersized 3 tec with a very high upside as a pass rusher but given his size he could struggle against the run ( which i dont think he will) but given its a passing leage now you think a lot of teams still would take him in round 3 or 4.

most 3 tecs still project to play a rushing role in a 3-4 as either DE but as an every down player no because he may struggle take on doubles as a 5 tec

[Romfal]

[Romfal]

no he's really a undersized 3 tec with a very high upside as a pass rusher but given his size he could struggle against the run ( which i dont think he will) but given its a passing leage now you think a lot of teams still would take him in round 3 or 4.

most 3 tecs still project to play a rushing role in a 3-4 as either DE but as an every down player no because he may struggle take on doubles as a 5 tec

most teams look for guys who are 6'5 280-300lbs to play a DE in a 3-4. They need to have the length to control 2 gaps. Could Grady play that at 6 foot? sure, is it ideal? not really.

Also those guys dont pass rush much, their job is to control the line.

[THE ICEMAN]

I bolded exactly why Grady Jarrett is not a nose in this scheme. Up to you if you want to listen or not.

he not the nose tackle but carrol cleary list him that as a one gapper then stats it as the nose tackle now weather that nose tackle is a 1 or 2 gapper depends on his skill set which jarrett is a 1 gapper.

depending on down and situation depends on if a "NT" is even in the game because jarrets skill set is as a 3 tec which he will see time at as that rotate and if hageman slips jarrett could grab the 3 tec spot as well

seeing as quinns defense is more 4-3 base ( basically a DE as a stand up outside Lber (Leo))

[THE ICEMAN]

hahahahahaha

you say he's a 1 gapper were is that in that defense?

you just made my point the NT can be either 1 or 2 gap player depending on his skill set and role the 1 gapper probably plays on rushing downs

your trying to make it as ever player has to play what there listed as.

Hageman can play any DL pos even DE because he's so athletic but his most effective pos is the 3 tec

[THE ICEMAN]

most teams look for guys who are 6'5 280-300lbs to play a DE in a 3-4. They need to have the length to control 2 gaps. Could Grady play that at 6 foot? sure, is it ideal? not really.

Also those guys dont pass rush much, their job is to control the line.

not in that defense

now a more traditional 3-4 yea

in this defense which is really different than most its more about getting up field and rushing the passer playing the run on the way to the QB thats why he fits as a 1 gapper because he can get upfield

[etherdome]

I'm not going to look up exact numbers, but lets say half the NFL runs a 3-4 defense. He is off the board for those teams because he is not a 2 gap player or a 0 tech Nose. Out of the 4-3 teams some run an over under, like us, with a NT(1 tech) whos job is to take on double teams from the Center and RG, freeing up the other DT(3 tech) to go 1 v 1 with the LG. Other 4-3 formations are the even, where both DT's(2 tech) line up over the respective guards. Lets say about half the teams ran each variation, that leaves 8 teams. Now some of these teams dont have a need at that position, combined with a limited number of picks and thats how a good player can drop to the 5th, when he is a scheme fit.

Also lets dismiss this "Grady can play NT" because he doesnt have the frame to take on two linemen, nor is it his strength.

Good reasoning. Add that to the fact that this draft featured a large number of quick, penetrating DT's. The numbers were stacked against Jarrett.

[Romfal]

he not the nose tackle but carrol cleary list him that as a one gapper then stats it as the nose tackle now weather that nose tackle is a 1 or 2 gapper depends on his skill set which jarrett is a 1 gapper.

depending on down and situation depends on if a "NT" is even in the game because jarrets skill set is as a 3 tec which he will see time at as that rotate and if hageman slips jarrett could grab the 3 tec spot as well

seeing as quinns defense is more 4-3 base ( basically a DE as a stand up outside Lber (Leo))

ok forget gaps for a minute, thats not really the point. The point of the Nose is to take on DOUBLE TEAMS. If he does that, then the 3 tech, the 5 tech and the Leo all have potential 1 on 1 mathcups with the remaining linemen.

Watch some Grady Jarrett tape, taking on double teams is NOT what he does well.

Our clear cut Nose tackle in this defense is Soliai. We will find out who else as camp unfolds, we have 3 pretty big UDFA's coming in as well.

you can run this scheme without a nose in sub package, thats where you see Michael Bennett move inside and all other kinds of rotations in Seattle. By all accounts, we are running the same defense.

[Romfal]

hahahahahaha

you say he's a 1 gapper were is that in that defense?

you just made my point the NT can be either 1 or 2 gap player depending on his skill set and role the 1 gapper probably plays on rushing downs

your trying to make it as ever player has to play what there listed as.

Hageman can play any DL pos even DE because he's so athletic but his most effective pos is the 3 tec

look at the green arrow, says 3 TECH right above it...

[THE ICEMAN]

most teams look for guys who are 6'5 280-300lbs to play a DE in a 3-4. They need to have the length to control 2 gaps. Could Grady play that at 6 foot? sure, is it ideal? not really.

Also those guys dont pass rush much, their job is to control the line.

you need to research the defense a little more as your trying to compare it to a 3-4 and the players that play in a 3-4 when its more like a attacking 4-3 defense

[THE ICEMAN]

ok forget gaps for a minute, thats not really the point. The point of the Nose is to take on DOUBLE TEAMS. If he does that, then the 3 tech, the 5 tech and the Leo all have potential 1 on 1 mathcups with the remaining linemen.

Watch some Grady Jarrett tape, taking on double teams is NOT what he does well.

Our clear cut Nose tackle in this defense is Soliai. We will find out who else as camp unfolds, we have 3 pretty big UDFA's coming in as well.

you can run this scheme without a nose in sub package, thats where you see Michael Bennett move inside and all other kinds of rotations in Seattle. By all accounts, we are running the same defense.

again it depends on the defense quinn wants to run

if he thinks Jarrett will have more impact he'll play the 1 tec if he feels like soliai can be good he'll play the NT your trying to compare

even as a 1 tec they'll still try to double him because they don't want him to get up feild now in this defense it makes it very hard to double him playing that role

if you ask quinn hes going to want 4 guys who can rush the passer not 3 so i see him playing the 1 tec more then the 0 tec your refering to there both "NTs" there gaps are just different

and thats my point you need to reseach the defense a little more to understand it as your referring to a 3-4 defense which jarret really doesn't fit but could probably be a decent 5 tec but not as inpactful as he would be as a 3 tec.

think jay ratliff

and role he played yes he's bigger but thats the role he played as a 1 tec and was very productive

[Romfal]

sounds like ur not reading a **** thing i'm saying lol. I'll let someone else argue with you.

[The Real Tony G.]

Grady is our Jordan Hill. Hill is 6'1", 303 lbs, and played NT in Quinn's system last year where he got 5.5 sacks due to his quickness from that spot.

Article for proof:

http://www.seahawks.com/news/2014/12/12/1212-blue-friday-hawkville-jordan-hill-making-most-his-opportunities

Grady's playing nose.

[nbostp]

So after watching him drop 3 rounds later than he was supposed to.......... Which team did the Falcons think was going to pick him up that it couldn't wait another 9 picks for?

[Francis York Morgan]

Grady is our Jordan Hill. Hill is 6'1", 303 lbs, and played NT in Quinn's system last year where he got 5.5 sacks due to his quickness from that spot.

Article for proof:

http://www.seahawks.com/news/2014/12/12/1212-blue-friday-hawkville-jordan-hill-making-most-his-opportunities

Grady's playing nose.

Should be noted that Hill really only plays nose in this weird pass rushing sub-package he has (it might be a nickel variant). Most games towards the end of the season where he was really coming on strong he played 30-40% of snaps, and that's with increased playing time. I think he'll use Jarrett similarly but he could also play a lot of 3T. Seriously doubt he'll play nose in the base defense either way.

[Romfal]

So after watching him drop 3 rounds later than he was supposed to.......... Which team did the Falcons think was going to pick him up that it couldn't wait another 9 picks for?

Jacksonville. They took Michael Bennett a bit later in the draft, similar player. Same defense.