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gazoo

Draft Analysis: Td Was Not The Problem, Smitty Was

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You don't know anything about how companies and high level management approach each other, court each other and eventually decide to work with each other. All of your silly "workforce" posts show that.

Besides, my speculation doesn't even hinge on that. As I said, they could also decide to keep TD for a year because Quinn was hired so late into the season that the transition would be too disruptive to the draft if they did it this year. Or because Quinn wanted one year with TD so he could get to know the roster and make a smoother transition.

I know you think my speculation that they will replace TD next year is dumb. I think your continued idolization of TD, despite his clearly poor results over 5 years, is dumb.

Your speculation is not just dumb, it's impossible. I'll gladly back that up with a sig bet. You in? Yeah, I didn't think so.

TD is not going anywhere unless Quinn also gets fired. Period. And that ain't happening anytime soon. The Falcons could go 0-16 this season and TD will still be the GM in 2016.

Just give it up. Your silly fantasy isn't coming true.

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The only revisionist history I've seen is from Vandy and the 2 guys that's usernames start with 'i", I forget. Crap like Quinn wanting TD gone in a year, and the John Abraham, Brent Grimes, Spoon, and Dunta Robinson situations.

Add "only two players would start on other teams" to that list.

That's my only thing. Criticize all you want. It's when people start making up sh*t that I feel the need to say something. I did the same thing when people would parrot all that "Smitty took his foot off the gas" nonsense.

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Add "only two players would start on other teams" to that list.

That's my only thing. Criticize all you want. It's when people start making up sh*t that I feel the need to say something. I did the same thing when people would parrot all that "Smitty took his foot off the gas" nonsense.

I'd say it would be in the high 90 percent range of people and pundits who recognized Smitty let up after getting leads on many occasions. Apparently only a tiny fraction of the fanbase realize this is all nonsense. Ok

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I'd say it would be in the high 90 percent range of people and pundits who recognized Smitty let up after getting leads on many occasions.

Hence, my use of the word "parrot."

The Detroit game last season where he sat on the ball two minutes before halftime with a big lead and three timeouts is about the only instance I can think of where Smitty made a clear decision not to try and score on a possession during a game that was still in reach by the opponent. And even in that game, he didn't kneel down because he was "afraid of hurting the other team's feelings," as some around here often suggested. Ridiculous.

Yes, Smitty's teams choked in many a second half. You can pin that on him and his generally uptight nature. It wasn't because they weren't trying to score.

Anyway, back on topic...

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Anyway, back on topic...

agree, the topic is just starting to generate some passive interest and I'd hate kill any potential momentum it may be gathering ;)

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agree, the topic is just starting to generate some passive interest and I'd hate kill any potential momentum it may be gathering wink.png

Then I definitely won't mention Matt Ryan and his place among the top QBs. Instant thread killer.

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Your speculation is not just dumb, it's impossible. I'll gladly back that up with a sig bet. You in? Yeah, I didn't think so.

TD is not going anywhere unless Quinn also gets fired. Period. And that ain't happening anytime soon. The Falcons could go 0-16 this season and TD will still be the GM in 2016.

Just give it up. Your silly fantasy isn't coming true.

No, I'm not doing a sig bet. I'm not betting money on it either. I don't know if it will happen ... but it would not surprise me. It fits with evidence that I see. We've already been over the evidence ... I'm not getting into it again on this thread. It's all up there.

Call it a silly fantasy if you want. I think it is a possibility. But who knows. Someone would have to kidnap Arthur Blank and pump him full of truth serum to find out. Truth serum doesn't exist, so there's no way we're going to know for sure.

I speculate, you disagree. ZOMG, what do we do now? Oh, right, this is a message board for people to talk about their thoughts and sometimes disagree with each other.

What would Ozzie Newsome have done to our roster with 7 years as GM? Even if he had Smitty as his coach, muddying things up with his "lack of direction"? I think our roster would have been pretty dam stout.

Did TD achieve that? Nope. You cannot argue that he did. All you can do is make excuses like "well his coach did not give him good direction" and "well he wasn't going to force players on his HC."

Fine. So TD might be a "servicable" GM. He might be slightly (very slightly) above average (like 51st percentile).

He is not GREAT. And he is not good enough. We've had ample evidence to see that by now, and a whole bunch of you are refusing to see it.

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No, I'm not doing a sig bet. I'm not betting money on it either. I don't know if it will happen ... but it would not surprise me. It fits with evidence that I see. We've already been over the evidence ... I'm not getting into it again on this thread. It's all up there.

Call it a silly fantasy if you want. I think it is a possibility. But who knows. Someone would have to kidnap Arthur Blank and pump him full of truth serum to find out. Truth serum doesn't exist, so there's no way we're going to know for sure.

I speculate, you disagree. ZOMG, what do we do now? Oh, right, this is a message board for people to talk about their thoughts and sometimes disagree with each other.

What would Ozzie Newsome have done to our roster with 7 years as GM? Even if he had Smitty as his coach, muddying things up with his "lack of direction"? I think our roster would have been pretty dam stout.

Did TD achieve that? Nope. You cannot argue that he did. All you can do is make excuses like "well his coach did not give him good direction" and "well he wasn't going to force players on his HC."

Fine. So TD might be a "servicable" GM. He might be slightly (very slightly) above average (like 51st percentile).

He is not GREAT. And he is not good enough. We've had ample evidence to see that by now, and a whole bunch of you are refusing to see it.

I know you're not doing a sig bet. I told you that. Just because you talk completely outta your a** doesn't mean you're stupid. I'll happily let you make one for me if we have a new GM next season, though. Anything you want. I'll put it down there.

As for Ozzie and what he would do with seven years as our GM, why don't you look at that stretch between the 2001 and 2007 seasons in which he tallied just one playoff win and three losing campaigns, including two with double digit losses. Make sure to check out his 2001 and 2005 drafts in particular, as those were real monsters - almost as "strong" as his more recent 2010 draft. And certainly make note of that draft in which he selected a punter in the 4th round who he would end up cutting three miserable seasons later. And to think there are people like yourself who totally lose their sh*t when TD takes a special teams player in the 7th.

Luckily for Ozzie, he had an owner who gave him a chance to hire a second head coach. Hmm... I wonder if that is significant?

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Greatness is easy to spot:

Quarterbacks: Joe Montana, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning

Coaches: Bill Belichik, Vince Lombardi, Bear Bryant

Defensive linemen: Mean Joe Greene

Linebackers: Lawrence Taylor

GMs: (Who can make an argument that TD's name belongs here?)

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Greatness is easy to spot:

Quarterbacks: Joe Montana, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning

Coaches: Bill Belichik, Vince Lombardi, Bear Bryant

Defensive linemen: Mean Joe Greene

Linebackers: Lawrence Taylor

GMs: (Who can make an argument that TD's name belongs here?)

Exactly WTF are you on about now?

What does this so-called "greatness" have to do with anything? Mickey Loomis had just two winning seasons in his first seven years as GM. Is that "greatness"? Did you easily spot it back in 2005 when the Saints were going 3-13 and contemplating a move out of New Orleans?

Nobody would ever place Loomis among the NFL's legendary GMs. And yet, he has a Super Bowl ring. Same as Rich McKay or Scott Pioli or Jerry Vainisi or any other number of championship winning GMs who would never be referred to as having "greatness." Because you don't need that to win a Super Bowl. You just have to do your job well.

Two Executive of the Year awards, four post season appearances and one NFCCG berth in seven years - along with the all the bouquets thrown at him by those in league circle as well as his new coach - says that TD has done his job pretty well.

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Two Executive of the Year awards, four post season appearances and one NFCCG berth in seven years - along with the all the bouquets thrown at him by those in league circle as well as his new coach - says that TD has done his job pretty well.

So, you're saying, "Yes, TD is the Joe Montana of GMs". Is that right?

If not, then where is he on that scale? Is he an Alex Smith? Is he the Joey Herrington of GMs?

It's not a hard question or a trick question. Seriously, about where on the scale do you size him up?

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Yes, because its completely reasonable to compare retired, or nearly retired GMs and hall of fame players and coaches to guys at the early stages of their careers. Such intellectual dishonesty here, you know this already yet do it anyway.

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So, you're saying, "Yes, TD is the Joe Montana of GMs". Is that right?

If not, then where is he on that scale? Is he an Alex Smith? Is he the Joey Herrington of GMs?

It's not a hard question or a trick question. Seriously, about where on the scale do you size him up?

He's the Matt Ryan of QB's.

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Smitty had 2 bad years and 5 good ones. If Quinn can top that, especially in the playoffs, Quinn will be considered better. If Quinn fails to at least equal what Smitty did, then it's a failure.

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Smitty had 2 bad years and 5 good ones. If Quinn can top that, especially in the playoffs, Quinn will be considered better. If Quinn fails to at least equal what Smitty did, then it's a failure.

Quinn has already out done Smitty!

Smitty never looked like a head coach!

It's not about wins and productivity around here it's about looking the part and being fired up!

The Falcons won in spite of Smitty so with a REAL head coach were going to the Superbowl this year.

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Nobody thinks it all falls on any one individual.but there is a reason Smitty was fired, and TD kept his job.

People just need to stop. TD is here for at least one more year, and if this draft turns out as good as it did based off how good it looks now, then he's going to be here for a good bit longer than that.

The vitriol is unwarranted, and sorry, you can't love Dan Quinn,, and hate Thomas Dimitroff, because by the looks of it, they are attached at the hip.Quinn couldn't be more expressive in how much he likes working with him.

I agree with you. If the Quinn/Dimitroff combo doesn't churn out results this upcoming season, TD may be on his way out.

I've always thought it would take at least 2 seasons to figure out who the problem was between Smitty and TD

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Quinn has already out done Smitty!

Smitty never looked like a head coach!

It's not about wins and productivity around here it's about looking the part and being fired up!

The Falcons won in spite of Smitty so with a REAL head coach were going to the Superbowl this year.

They won in SPITE of Smitty?? You have some info that none of us are aware of??

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They won in SPITE of Smitty?? You have some info that none of us are aware of??

Sarcasm on full blast as Gazoo would say it was a straw man statement!

After the 1st losing season, the DL and OL coaches were fired.

After 2nd losing season, Head Coach was fired.

Three will not be TD's lucky number!

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Smitty had 2 bad years and 5 good ones. If Quinn can top that, especially in the playoffs, Quinn will be considered better. If Quinn fails to at least equal what Smitty did, then it's a failure.

What if Quinn has 4 good years and 3 bad ones but has more playoff wins?

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You b@stards leave Uncle Smitty alone. He's served his rime and is square with the house again. If you want to bltch about someone, bltch about Vick or Petrino.

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Yes, because its completely reasonable to compare retired, or nearly retired GMs and hall of fame players and coaches to guys at the early stages of their careers. Such intellectual dishonesty here, you know this already yet do it anyway.

No, not at all. You're right, that would be unfair.

But it is not unfair to evaluate someone's performance. We evaluate players all the time. Some kick butt in college and don't translate well to the pro's (Tebow or Manziel -- at least so far). We don't hem and haw, we call it like it is, and they end up on the bench or out of the league.

So let's evaluate TD's performance. It's not "hate". It's not "vitriol". It's merely looking at the bottom line results.

So where does TD stack up so far? He doesn't have to be the "Joe Montana of GM's" yet. That would be an unfair expectation.

I'm just asking you: what is he? Based on his bottom line performance so far, where do you rank him? Compare him to a QB, or give him a score between 1 and 10, or find some other way to quantify it.

That gets right to the heart of the question you asked when you started this thread. Like I said before, it's not a hard question or a trick question.

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Quinn has already out done Smitty!

Smitty never looked like a head coach!

It's not about wins and productivity around here it's about looking the part and being fired up!

The Falcons won in spite of Smitty so with a REAL head coach were going to the Superbowl this year.

I take it you are being sarcastic.

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No, not at all. You're right, that would be unfair.

But it is not unfair to evaluate someone's performance. We evaluate players all the time. Some kick butt in college and don't translate well to the pro's (Tebow or Manziel -- at least so far). We don't hem and haw, we call it like it is, and they end up on the bench or out of the league.

So let's evaluate TD's performance. It's not "hate". It's not "vitriol". It's merely looking at the bottom line results.

So where does TD stack up so far? He doesn't have to be the "Joe Montana of GM's" yet. That would be an unfair expectation.

I'm just asking you: what is he? Based on his bottom line performance so far, where do you rank him? Compare him to a QB, or give him a score between 1 and 10, or find some other way to quantify it.

That gets right to the heart of the question you asked when you started this thread. Like I said before, it's not a hard question or a trick question.

How can there be so many adamant TD defenders, in a thread addressing the very topic of TD's performance, and no one will answer this simple question?

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