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To Those Wanting A Rb In The First Round


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If we decided to trade down into the 12-15 range I'd love to snatch up Cameron Erving. Dude can literally play anywhere on the line. That is invaluable. He's highly athletic and a perfect fit in a ZBS. He'd be our day 1 LG. If Hawley doesn't work out then we have our center of the future.

Ahhhhh heeeeemmmmm

*Clears throat*

R_The_Great: "James Mafucin Stone"

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You can throw out all of the facts in the world that show it's stupid to take a RB in the top 10 and these guys won't care.

They're going against every single thing they preached to the board last year about fixing the lines first because the dude plays for UGA.

They're clearly thinking with emotions and not logic much like females.

Well, first : WHO IS THE THEY? I know who you are talking about, the LUV BUGS when it comes to homer drafts. Perhaps?

Not me that's for sure. Fixing the D-line and O-line are priorities in my opinion. But then again you never know with a NEW and might I say again NEW coaching staff. Who knows what direction they want to go with the Falcons players. Not going to call them a TEAM yet, because until they show they are that would just be wrong to call them a TEAM...

I like your optimistic attitude though, REALISTIC attitude. Everyone assumes with all the rah rah and coach/player speak that enthusiasm is going to make the Falcons a better team. I've bought into it myself, I am now a card carrying member of the NEW ATLANTA FALCONS POWERS THAT BE, with the exception of TD having a say that is.

We shall see how this works out...... I like how things are going, but that doesn't mean great things are going to happen. I've seen the parade here on the forums too many times when it comes to players being drafted only to have all their balloons busted when reality hit them.

We shall see.....

GO FALCONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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I don't specifically endorse taking a RB in the first, but I do know in my bpa mind that Gurley is a much better prospect than the third or fourth pass rusher.

I also appreciate tying to get pick history out there for people, but there are just too many variables year to year to make a case this way.

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Just laying out the facts, not trying to invalidate anyone's opinion. Just want to offer my own and try and convince others that we can fix - or take a big step towards fixing - both the pass rush and the run this year. Imo, it can't be broken down to individual players, but I'd argue what we mostly need is a top 15 sack guy, and I'd also like a top 15 back. Not going to do every year, but this is a pattern every year, feel free to try and disprove me yourself. I encourage it. Anyways, here's a list of 2014 leaders by when they were drafted:

Sack Leaders

Justin Houston (3rd round)

JJ Watt (1st round)

Elvis Dumervil (4th round)

Mario Williams (1st round)

Connor Barwin (2nd round)

Von Miller (1st round)

Ryan Kerrigan (1st round)

Jason Pierre Paul (1st round)

Terrell Suggs (1st round)

Everson Griffen (4th round)

Cameron Wake (UDFA)

Paul Kruger (2nd round)

Clay Matthews (1st round)

Robert Quinn (1st round)

Demarcus Ware (1st round)

Rushing Leaders

Demarco Murray (3rd round)

Leveon Bell (2nd round)

Lesean McCoy (2nd round)

Marshawn Lynch (1st round)

Justin Forsett (7th round)

Arian Foster (UDFA)

Eddie Lacy (2nd round)

Jeremy Hill (2nd round)

Frank Gore (3rd round)

Lamarr Miller (4th round)

Alfred Morris (6th round)

Matt Forte (2nd round)

Jamaal Charles (3rd round)

Mark Ingram (1st round)

Joique Bell (UDFA)

There are coincidences, and anomalies, but this is neither. Our best shot is to take a pass rusher in the first - not to reach for one, but if our pass rusher is there, to target him - and to target a RB in the 2nd or 3rd round. I want a run game as much as you do, but you sacrifice the pass rush for the run if you take a RB in the first, whereas taking a DE/OLB in the first doesn't sacrifice the run game at all. I just think that's what's best for the team.

CURRENT FALCON PASS RUSHERS BEST SEASONS

Clayborn - 7.5 sack year

Reed - 6.0 sack year

Babineaux - 6.0 sack year

Biermann - 5.0 sack year

Schofield - 4.5 sack year

CURRENT FALCON RUNNING BACKS BEST SEASONS

Freeman - 248 yards rushing

Antone - 145 yards rushing

DiMarco - 0 yards rushing

Smith - 0 yards rushing

Wingo - 0 yards rushing

If you were a Martian that landed on Earth this morning, what would you say is a bigger need for the Atlanta Football Falcons?

Running back or edge rusher?

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Drafting a RB in the first round is butt-monkey stupid.

Drafting an injury-plagued, gimpy RB who might not even play this year is beyond and beneath stupid. Anyone who believes we should draft Gurley should be sterilized before they can further dilute the gene pool.

If you want to help the run game at #8, Scherff is going to make as big a difference as a RB, and will also help keep Matt Ryan healthy in the passing game.

If you have advocated Gurley at #8, you owe this entire board an apology. You owe all of HUMANITY an apology.

Old school my new man of sound reason and truth! Welcome!

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CURRENT FALCON PASS RUSHERS BEST SEASONS

Clayborn - 7.5 sack year

Reed - 6.0 sack year

Babineaux - 6.0 sack year

Biermann - 5.0 sack year

Schofield - 4.5 sack year

CURRENT FALCON RUNNING BACKS BEST SEASONS

Freeman - 248 yards rushing

Antone - 145 yards rushing

DiMarco - 0 yards rushing

Smith - 0 yards rushing

Wingo - 0 yards rushing

If you were a Martian that landing on Earth this morning, what would you say is a bigger need for the Atlanta Football Falcons?

Running back or edge rusher?

No one's suggesting we don't fill that hole, and if they are, I'm a little surprised. But it's like you didn't read the post. We can fill both needs just as well drafting a RB in the 2nd/3rd and a pass rusher in the 1st. If we draft a RB in the 1st, we might have filled it marginally better, but we could still easily get a 1000+ yd rusher in the 2nd or 3rd. We can't get a pass rusher nearly as good in the 2nd or 3rd unless someone slips drastically.

You don't just fill needs based on what is a bigger need. That's why you don't draft a kicker in the 1st just because your kicker sucked last year. Certain positions have higher value, and certain positions still have yielded proven results by drafting later, while others are much riskier. It's not black and white man. Come on. You know this. You're being blinded by Gurley love. Would getting one of the other several RBs you've mentioned (Ajayi, David Johnson) in the 2nd or 3rd while still getting Beasley in the 1st really somehow be worse to you than Gurley and Nate Orchard?

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The OP data is correct. It's also a large enough set of data, it's not random.

It also just makes sense. And it doesn't point toward picking a RB in the 7th round and hoping, that's stupid.

It points to there being very good RBs in the 2nd and 3rd, in general, and then system fits, etc, become a larger element than the RB themselves, as long as they are "good enough."

You don't see this with Pass rushers, CB's, OT's generally.

So, it doesn't diminish the need of a RB, it just goes to show, if you need a starter and good player at DE, OT, and RB...you can probably do that if you go pass rusher 1st, OT 2nd, and RB third, and you very likely won't if you go RB first, OT 2nd, DE third.

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If we get Beasley at 8 I will be in total shock. If we get Fowler I will again be all in he is a day 1 starter and Beasley would get some great playing time not a day 1 starter but good playing time. But there going to be gone. That being said grab a rotion guy at 8 because I don't want Gurley to be a Falcon. We have the great Freeman. I would beat they have there D already in mind who will start. So lets get our back up guy. They revamped the worst LBs in the NFL. Lets just wate till next year to fix the running game. Oh wate Zone blocking any body can run in it. And when Freeman whifs on a block like he did last year and we get us some TJ. Oh wate I have heard they use the FB to block our 1 FB whos about as good as it gets.

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If we get Beasley at 8 I will be in total shock. If we get Fowler I will again be all in he is a day 1 starter and Beasley would get some great playing time not a day 1 starter but good playing time. But there going to be gone. That being said grab a rotion guy at 8 because I don't want Gurley to be a Falcon. We have the great Freeman. I would beat they have there D already in mind who will start. So lets get our back up guy. They revamped the worst LBs in the NFL. Lets just wate till next year to fix the running game. Oh wate Zone blocking any body can run in it. And when Freeman whifs on a block like he did last year and we get us some TJ. Oh wate I have heard they use the FB to block our 1 FB whos about as good as it gets.

Can I get an interpreter here? Maybe use my Phone-A-Friend lifeline? I've read it twice and--- I got nuthin'.

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No one's suggesting we don't fill that hole, and if they are, I'm a little surprised. But it's like you didn't read the post. We can fill both needs just as well drafting a RB in the 2nd/3rd and a pass rusher in the 1st. If we draft a RB in the 1st, we might have filled it marginally better, but we could still easily get a 1000+ yd rusher in the 2nd or 3rd. We can't get a pass rusher nearly as good in the 2nd or 3rd unless someone slips drastically.

You don't just fill needs based on what is a bigger need. That's why you don't draft a kicker in the 1st just because your kicker sucked last year. Certain positions have higher value, and certain positions still have yielded proven results by drafting later, while others are much riskier. It's not black and white man. Come on. You know this. You're being blinded by Gurley love. Would getting one of the other several RBs you've mentioned (Ajayi, David Johnson) in the 2nd or 3rd while still getting Beasley in the 1st really somehow be worse to you than Gurley and Nate Orchard?

The problem is Fowler, Beasley and Ray are expected to be gone at eight. That leaves Gregory or Dupree as the next best pass rushers. Both have question marks and may be considered reaches at eight. Compared to those two, Scherff, Waynes and Collins, Gurley is arguably the BPA. What would make us stronger?

Gregory and Abdullah or Gurley and Harold?

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The problem is Fowler, Beasley and Ray are expected to be gone at eight. That leaves Gregory or Dupree as the next best pass rushers. Both have question marks and may be considered reaches at eight. Compared to those two, Scherff, Waynes and Collins, Gurley is arguably the BPA. What would make us stronger?

Gregory and Abdullah or Gurley and Harold?

Gregory and Abdullah. Or Dupree and Abdullah. There's a chance Beasley will be there too, but seriously doubt Harold comes anywhere close to making it out of the first. Outside of that, I'd take Scherff/Collins -> Kikaha -> David Johnson before Gurley and then whoever as well. They're still elite and arguably #1 at their position, there's an argument they're BPA. And we improve both our defense and run game significantly that way. Only way of coming close to that is Gurley+Marpet, and that is a big hit to pass rush since the 3rd round pass rushers won't be in the same hemisphere as the 1st or even 2nd rounders. Gurley at 8 just doesn't make sense.

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Gregory and Abdullah. Or Dupree and Abdullah. There's a chance Beasley will be there too, but seriously doubt Harold comes anywhere close to making it out of the first. Outside of that, I'd take Scherff/Collins -> Kikaha -> David Johnson before Gurley and then whoever as well. They're still elite and arguably #1 at their position, there's an argument they're BPA. And we improve both our defense and run game significantly that way. Only way of coming close to that is Gurley+Marpet, and that is a big hit to pass rush since the 3rd round pass rushers won't be in the same hemisphere as the 1st or even 2nd rounders. Gurley at 8 just doesn't make sense.

LMAO at Gregory and Abdullah or Dupree and Abdullah.

Let me ask you this. What if Quinn thinks he's fixed the pass rush and it is not as big a need as you and the rest of TATF believe? I mean he did recently say he thinks they hit a home run in free agency. Yall boys ever think about that? I mean it's possible. Let's examine that premise:

Beer - was on a 9.0 sack pace in his last eight games

Clayborn - has a 7.5 sack season under his belt

Reed - has a 6.0 sack season and will be moved back to the edge where he is a better pass rusher

Babineaux - has a 6.0 sack season as a 3T. Always in the backfield

Schofield - has a 4.5 sack season in spot duty and knows the system

Hageman - showed flashes of interior pass rushing prowess late last year. Looks bigger and stronger this season

Maponga - supposedly considered one of the top four Leo prospects on the roster by Quinn

Jacques - also considered one of the four current Leos

Keep in mind, Quinn is supposedly the developer of pass rushing demons. A pass rushing guru. In his best years as a DC he didn't have any double digit sack men like yall boys are craving. Just a bunch of five sackers. I doubt if he ever had anyone with more than eight or nine sacks. He seems to be of the same school of thought as Mike "I'd rather have ten four sackers than four ten sackers" Nolan.

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LMAO at Gregory and Abdullah or Dupree and Abdullah.

Let me ask you this. What if Quinn thinks he's fixed the pass rush and it is not as big a need as you and the rest of TATF believe? I mean he did recently say he thinks they hit a home run in free agency. Yall boys ever think about that? I mean it's possible. Let's examine that premise:

Beer - was on a 9.0 sack pace in his last eight games

Clayborn - has a 7.5 sack season under his belt

Reed - has a 6.0 sack season and will be moved back to the edge where he is a better pass rusher

Babineaux - has a 6.0 sack season as a 3T. Always in the backfield

Schofield - has a 4.5 sack season in spot duty and knows the system

Hageman - showed flashes of interior pass rushing prowess late last year. Looks bigger and stronger this season

Maponga - supposedly considered one of the top four Leo prospects on the roster by Quinn

Jacques - also considered one of the four current Leos

Keep in mind, Quinn is supposedly the developer of pass rushing demons. A pass rushing guru. In his best years as a DC he didn't have any double digit sack men like yall boys are craving. Just a bunch of five sackers. I doubt if he ever had anyone with more than eight or nine sacks. He seems to be of the same school of thought as Mike "I'd rather have ten four sackers than four ten sackers" Nolan.

Pace doesn't matter. At our LEO spot, we don't have anyone who's had more than 4.5 sacks. That's horrid for a designated pass rusher. And it's not the same as the yardage totals for RBs, can guarantee we could plug Freeman in and he'd triple or quadruple his current yardage totals, but that'd be stupid.

I also don't believe in development the way you do. He can bring the best out of people, he can't coach up someone who never had the talent in the first place. And we need a talent infusion there.

Why "lmao" at Dupree/Gregory with Abdullah? Both pass rushers have a healthy chance of racking up double digit sacks multiple times in their careers and being all around great players, and Abdullah is probably the second most talented back in the draft behind Gurley. Can guarantee if his fumbling issues have improved (as they seem to be) and he doesn't get injured he'll have multiple 1000+ yard seasons. Same goes for Gurley but his chance at being injured is higher.

Your want for Gurley just doesn't make much sense when you look at the big picture.

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Taking a gimpy, one-legged injury-prone RB at #8 would be unforgivably stupid. There are too many backs just as good that can be had in the third round.

Heck, go watch tape of South Dakota State's Zach Zenner against Nebraska. His line was woefully overmatched, but he reads and sets up blocks better than most seasoned pros. In the open field he was splitting db's and blowing past them. In a one-cut-and-go zbs, I can see Zenner becoming our Terrell Davis, and will likely be available in the 6th or 7th.

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