Is Youth And Inexperience The Problem?

[THE ICEMAN]

Figure i'd post this i said it in a few topics

Looking at our current roster it seems to be the case. i wanted to blame smith and the rest of the coaches but fact is he was pretty successful his first 5 seasons and the teams had plenty of vets. And they are pushing this 1-0 thing now or one game at a time so i said well are we really that inexperienced and yea we are.

Starters on offense in in 2012 we had Ryan,Turner,Snelling,Julio,White,TG,Baker,Blalock,Mcclure,Konz,Clabo and other guys like snelling who played RB/FB and HD and rodgers

this year we have Ryan,Jackson,Julio,Roddy,toilolo,Mathews,Blalock,Stone,Asamoah,Schraeder and other guys like Freeman,Rodgers,HD

the OL has a ton of inexperience and Jackson as long as he's played seems to have always been on bad teams and he's well past his prime probably should be freeman in there. even then the offense isn't as bad as the defense and the offense is still capable of putting up big numbers.

2012 defensive starters Abe,Babs,Peters,Kroy,Spoon,nich,Dent,Decoud,Moore,Asante,Robinson and other guys like walker,owens,peterson,grimes were still around as well. they weren't the greatest defensive or anything special but they had experience

our starters now Osi,Solia,Jackson/Peters,Kroy,PW,Bartu,Shembo,Trufant,Alford,Ish,Lowery and lots of other guys are getting snaps like Mass(before the injury)Goodman,Hageman and other but the inexperience with this unit is killing us.

he11 4 out of the 5 OLmen in 2012 had played like 5 seasons together and not shocking thats the main problem on offense now and on defense Abe,Babs,Spoon,Kroy had been here for a while Moore had been the starter for three seasons Decoud was the starter for four seasons Robinson was the starter for the 3rd strait year here Asante has huge amount of experience and a lot of playoff games.

the youth/inexperience on the OL and defense is the main problem not the coaching sure they could do better and yea we can hire a better coach but this is the coaching staff that nearly got us to the superbowl with a team that had a lot more experience.

We blew leads in the vikings game and double digit leads in the giants and lions game those games would have us at 7-3 now we just blew a 16-3 lead against the panthers luckly we won that one.

I think to many people are over looking all the youth on the OL and defense and are just blaming the coaching staff sure its there job to coach them up but if they don't understand what your teaching them or there not applying it what do you do then? With Spoon and Moore out that two key guys who have played in a lot of games were there good or bad pretty much our entire secondary and LBs are 1st or 2nd year players.

[ukfalc]

It is definitely a factor, tied partly to the shortage of high value draft picks in 2011/12. We should never have been in a position of having to rely on a pair of 2nd round players on the OL last year, especially when one of them was a late 3rd round pick considered a raw projects.

[THE ICEMAN]

It is definitely a factor, tied partly to the shortage of high value draft picks in 2011/12. We should never have been in a position of having to rely on a pair of 2nd round players on the OL last year, especially when one of them was a late 3rd round pick considered a raw projects.

i agree also remember so many around here saying we need to get younger and more athletic well were younger and more athletic but are paying the price.

I do think Spoon and Moore would make a huge difference in just helping the young guys getting them into the right defense making adjustment and so on i believe PW is our play caller now on defense and hes only a 2nd year player.

But do credit some of the guys they have upped there game Alford and trufant are getting better even though they still give up the big play PW is improving somewhat i guess Homles had played much much better Stone has come in and played like a vet and not a rookie but just look back at him the holding call on suh was a huge mistake in a game he really held his own against suh.

[ballfan]

The biggest problem with the roster is WAY too many starters north of 30. Athletes over 30 get hurt and take longer to get back to full speed. They also play with a level of caution. Babs, Osi, Roddy, Hester, SJax, Blalock, H Douglas, Soliai all over 30. Even scarier is the number of starter NEAR 30: Biermann, Sam Baker, Willie Mo.

I exclude Bryant and Ryan from the list, but Bryant is 39!

There is a reason most football careers last less than 3 years in the NFL.

[Mid-Nite-Toker]

As far as penalties...youth and inexperience has played a part in this years and last years woes.

SmittyBall...doesn't want penalties. You know...winning football.

But, But, But...Smitty is too conservative and only plays veterans. Kiss my arse.

[ballfan]

I left off Antone Smith (29). Part of the problem is TD's method of drafting 4 years starters. many of his picks are 23 or 24 as rookies. Alford for example is 26 already. For some positions experience is critical, but for speed and quickness (and healing and staying on the field) younger is better.

[ukfalc]

The biggest problem with the roster is WAY too many starters north of 30. Athletes over 30 get hurt and take longer to get back to full speed. They also play with a level of caution. Babs, Osi, Roddy, Hester, SJax, Blalock, H Douglas, Soliai all over 30. Even scarier is the number of starter NEAR 30: Biermann, Sam Baker, Willie Mo.

I exclude Bryant and Ryan from the list, but Bryant is 39!

There is a reason most football careers last less than 3 years in the NFL.

That's tru and is a result of having too few high draft picks at a time when we also had increasing financial pressures on our cap because our 08&09 draftees were UFA's. It left us filling holes with cheap 30+ players, because we couldn't afford younger FAs.

The lack of leadership from that group has been disappointing. Maybe the way it was edited did him a disservice, but seeing Roddy goofing off and taking it easy on Hard Knocks didn't impress me. I wanted to see a hard working veteran, setting a good example for the younger players.

[trubirdfan4life]

It's not that they are young, its just that they aren't very good....pretty simple. Jake Matthews is young and makes rookie mistakes, but we all can see that he can play, those other guys? Not so much.

[blkbigdog35]

I don't think we are too young, however if coaches would do their jobs inexperience wouldn't be a concern!

[Mid-Nite-Toker]

It's not that they are young, its just that they aren't very good....pretty simple. Jake Matthews is young and makes rookie mistakes, but we all can see that he can play, those other guys? Not so much.

JM is a notorious penalty maker. Smitty is criticized for playing veterans..making less mistakes penalties. It is about youth...Smitty has played them.

[ukfalc]

It's not that they are young, its just that they aren't very good....pretty simple. Jake Matthews is young and makes rookie mistakes, but we all can see that he can play, those other guys? Not so much.

That is down in part to where players were drafted.

We shouldn't be relying on 2 UDFAs to hold our LB unit together. We shouldn't be relying on a bunch of 4-7th round picks for our pass rush. We and shouldn't have been relying on a 2nd year, late 3rd round OT to start at OT last year.

Most mid and late round picks that make rosters are backups and role players. The % that becone starters, let alone good starters (I.e one of the top 10-12 players in the NFL at their position) is not very high - and those who do develop in to starters often take 3+years . When you start needing those players to play key roles and to do early in their careers, the odds of it working are stacked against you.

[jlrfalcon]

Ideally you want a mix of youth and veterans -

Too many veterans=

1) Too much infighting between them and with coaches (cause the vets know what is best)

2) Short window for possible Superbowl run (youth never develops cause it never plays)

3) Players likely underpaid to fit them all in salary cap (possible title can only make up for pay so much)

4) Older players are likely on the decline not the rise

Too many youth=

1) No experience with unique game and season situations (and likely to lose the close ones)

2) Still used to shorter games and seasons from their youth

3) Hide injuries and ignorance because they fear not being around next season

4) Refs unlikely to show them any slack (pass interference)

The Falcons are a good mix of veterans and youth by their roster but the coaches are obsessed with not letting the youth play until veteran injuries force the youth into action.

[trubirdfan4life]

That is down in part to where players were drafted.

We shouldn't be relying on 2 UDFAs to hold our LB unit together. We shouldn't be relying on a bunch of 4-7th round picks for our pass rush. We and shouldn't have been relying on a 2nd year, late 3rd round OT to start at OT last year.

Most mid and late round picks that make rosters are backups and role players. The % that becone starters, let alone good starters (I.e one of the top 10-12 players in the NFL at their position) is not very high - and those who do develop in to starters often take 3+years . When you start needing those players to play key roles and to do early in their careers, the odds of it working are stacked against you.

we were relying on spoon(1st round pick) to hold the LBs together....we were relying on OSI(2nd rounder) to give us some pass rush pressure....we were relying on sam baker(1st rounder), blalock(2nd rounder) konz(2nd round) reynolds (5th) and holmes(3rd)...absolutely nothing wrong with that....they ALL got hurt and that throws your plans out the window

we haven't been leaning on late round picks, the early round picks have been hurt for the last two seasons.

you have got to get past equating draft position with football ability....if only the 1st and 2nd rounders have talent, why keep drafting for 7 full rounds? just stop the draft after 3 rounds. Our problem isn't WHERE the guys are drafted, but WHO is drafted....I don't care if we trade and get 2 1st rounders per season, if you pick badly, guess what the outcome will be

[vel]

Ideally you want a mix of youth and veterans -

Too many veterans=

1) Too much infighting between them and with coaches (cause the vets know what is best)

2) Short window for possible Superbowl run (youth never develops cause it never plays)

3) Players likely underpaid to fit them all in salary cap (possible title can only make up for pay so much)

4) Older players are likely on the decline not the rise

Too many youth=

1) No experience with unique game and season situations (and likely to lose the close ones)

2) Still used to shorter games and seasons from their youth

3) Hide injuries and ignorance because they fear not being around next season

4) Refs unlikely to show them any slack (pass interference)

The Falcons are a good mix of veterans and youth by their roster but the coaches are obsessed with not letting the youth play until veteran injuries force the youth into action.

This.

Couple that with Smitty's downright fear of mistakes and you see why young players rarely play unless they are first/second round picks.

Youth and inexperience will always be youth and inexperience until they get experience. We don't do that here unless forced too. If a younger player shows potential, he has to earn his playing time doing things that don't highlight his skillset (RBs on special teams, WRs needing to be blockers, DEs stopping the run, etc).

[toadfishtom]

Part of the problem,as someone already stated you need a mix of youth and experience.The Falcons have multiple problems contributing to our 4-6 record....BUT HEY....we are in first place ,poised to run the table and once we hit the playoffs......you know the rest

[ukfalc]

we were relying on spoon(1st round pick) to hold the LBs together....we were relying on OSI(2nd rounder) to give us some pass rush pressure....we were relying on sam baker(1st rounder), blalock(2nd rounder) konz(2nd round) reynolds (5th) and holmes(3rd)...absolutely nothing wrong with that....they ALL got hurt and that throws your plans out the windowwe haven't been leaning on late round picks, the early round picks have been hurt for the last two seasons.you have got to get past equating draft position with football ability....if only the 1st and 2nd rounders have talent, why keep drafting for 7 full rounds? just stop the draft after 3 rounds. Our problem isn't WHERE the guys are drafted, but WHO is drafted....I don't care if we trade and get 2 1st rounders per season, if you pick badly, guess what the outcome will be

There is talent late in the draft, but there's just a lot less of it and the players generally have a lower upside, meaning that the odds of finding good starters falls drastically. Since 08, the 4th-7th round of the draft have seen only 20 pro bowlers drafted and many of them are special teamers. That's 20 out of over 900 draft selections (excluding the 2014 crop).

You cannot trade away high value selections and expect to make up for it by finding quality starters in rounds 4-7 instead, because there simply aren't enough good quality players to make it feasible. That doesn't mean those round are unimportant - as good backups and role players are important parts of any good team. The problem comes when you put yourself in a position where you are relying on those selections to be a lot more than that, expecting them to fill important starting positions within 1-2 years. This board has unrealistic expectations in that respect.

It's all well and good to say that WHO you draft is important, but in reality the draft is a lottery even for teams who spend millions of dollars and tens of thousands of hours scouting talent. There isn't a team in the NFL who hits on late round players. If your team building strategy is to trade high picks away make up for it by finding starters late in the draft, it is highly likely that you will fail.

[vel]

Part of the problem,as someone already stated you need a mix of youth and experience.The Falcons have multiple problems contributing to our 4-6 record....BUT HEY....we are in first place ,poised to run the table and once we hit the playoffs......you know the rest

We'll most likely get a first round exit, potentially blown out. I mean it's only happened 75% of the time we make it.

[toadfishtom]

We'll most likely get a first round exit, potentially blown out. I mean it's only happened 75% of the time we make it.

Exactly

[trubirdfan4life]

There is talent late in the draft, but there's just a lot less of it and the players generally have a lower upside, meaning that the odds of finding good starters falls drastically. Since 08, the 4th-7th round of the draft have seen only 20 pro bowlers drafted and many of them are special teamers. That's 20 out of over 900 draft selections (excluding the 2014 crop).

You cannot trade away high value selections and expect to make up for it by finding quality starters in rounds 4-7 instead, because there simply aren't enough good quality players to make it feasible. That doesn't mean those round are unimportant - as good backups and role players are important parts of any good team. The problem comes when you put yourself in a position where you are relying on those selections to be a lot more than that, expecting them to fill important starting positions within 1-2 years. This board has unrealistic expectations in that respect.

It's all well and good to say that WHO you draft is important, but in reality the draft is a lottery even for teams who spend millions of dollars and tens of thousands of hours scouting talent. There isn't a team in the NFL who hits on late round players. If your team building strategy is to trade high picks away make up for it by finding starters late in the draft, it is highly likely that you will fail.

obviously you are talking about the julio trade...that was about 4 years ago...that horse has been beaten to death, resurrected and beaten to death repeatedly. No time machines.we have to look at the issues that are staring us in the face TODAY. TODAY, we have mediocre talent on this team at key positions and that is what keeps us below .500. NOT the julio trade. if a team misses on ALL of the free agent guys and the drafted guys, well you will lose games...our situation has nothing to do with a trade that happened 4 years ago...its about what has happened since then. you speak of UDFAs....well how badly have you drafted if undrafted guys come in and take the jobs of drafted guys...that has happened all over this roster

[isproab]

Youth can sometimes be the problem, but its not in our case. We just don't have talent in the right places, bottom line. Young guys like Julio Jones, AJ Green, Gronkowski, Kuechly, Alfred Morris, Larry Warford, Vontaze Burfict, Keenan Allen, Kiko Alonso, Aldon Smith, Von Miller, Patrick Peterson, Lavonte David, Chandler Jones, Trufant, Tyron Smith, Robert Quinn, Andrew Luck and Matt Ryan all made immediate impacts. Especially as young players.

Falcons have 3 players on my list, granted I'm more familiar with my team that most other NFL teams. Falcons just have not had enough hits. We are talking about 7 years of draft. Guys from rounds 1-3 need to be impact guys. So that's what, 21 guys from that pool. Think we may have lost 4 or 5 picks at least from the Gonzalez and Julio deal. So out of a potential of 15 or so, we have 6 impact players. I'll add Matthews, William Moore and Alford. So that's about a 40% hit rate, 60% misses. Combine that with almost all of the free agent misses and its easy to see why we are behind the 8 ball.

I think things can get turned around and headed in the right direction, we NEED to hit on free agents and draft picks. NO room for error, we have used all our mulligans already.

Edited November 22, 2014 by isproab

[PokerSteve]

I don't think we are too young, however if coaches would do their jobs inexperience wouldn't be a concern!

Every team in the league experiences high turn-over every season. Have we had a little more injuries and turn-over? Yes, but with quality coaching and an HC, OC and DC worth their salt, you adapt, you find ways to help the young, inexperienced guys succeed. This coaching staff is still focused on only playing those with the highest contracts, or their designated Sacred Cows like Biermann. I've watched these coaches all season and if this staff genuinely wants to win, all I can say is they dam sure hide it well.

[blkbigdog35]

Every team in the league experiences high turn-over every season. Have we had a little more injuries and turn-over? Yes, but with quality coaching and an HC, OC and DC worth their salt, you adapt, you find ways to help the young, inexperienced guys succeed. This coaching staff is still focused on only playing those with the highest contracts, or their designated Sacred Cows like Biermann. I've watched these coaches all season and if this staff genuinely wants to win, all I can say is they dam sure hide it well.

Exactly poker!