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5 hours ago, Carter said:

So annoyed with John Walker and not in the way they probably hope. I don’t know if it’s the character or the acting (probably both) but I just don’t like him at all. Even my kids were groaning about how he should have died instead of Lamar because the character sucks and Battlestar was so much better. I have to agree.

But that final image of him holding the bloody shield is also undoubtedly one of the most epic shots they’ve given us so far. I don’t know where it goes from here but that’s going to hang on Sam and Bucky both very heavily I would imagine. And probably lend credence to Bucky’s anger with Sam that he should have never given up the shield.

idk man it kinda sounds you're reacting exactly the way they hoped you would

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1 hour ago, achilles return said:

idk man it kinda sounds you're reacting exactly the way they hoped you would

I mean... maybe lol

I genuinely dislike the character and don’t find the acting especially noteworthy. Pretty stale and cliche with very little range. The only decent scene he has had was after the fight with the Wakandans where his spirit was crushed by them not even being super soldiers.

The writing has been lazy just pitting him as the guy who messes everything up to be easily disliked as the antagonist. If the character isn’t in anything else after this I would be 100% fine with it, which I can’t honestly say about any of the other MCU antagonists or villains I can think of. If that’s what they wanted the audience to feel then I fell right into it I guess 

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2 hours ago, Carter said:

I mean... maybe lol

I genuinely dislike the character and don’t find the acting especially noteworthy. Pretty stale and cliche with very little range. The only decent scene he has had was after the fight with the Wakandans where his spirit was crushed by them not even being super soldiers.

The writing has been lazy just pitting him as the guy who messes everything up to be easily disliked as the antagonist. If the character isn’t in anything else after this I would be 100% fine with it, which I can’t honestly say about any of the other MCU antagonists or villains I can think of. If that’s what they wanted the audience to feel then I fell right into it I guess 

 

 

Let's hope things pick up with him being more of a full fledged villain.

 

Sometimes it just works better that way.

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9 hours ago, DonOfThemBirds said:

 

 

Let's hope things pick up with him being more of a full fledged villain.

 

Sometimes it just works better that way.

I've enjoyed the gray-areas of all of the characters in Wandavision and this show.  To me that's more interesting than some mad scientist or an alien trying to destroy the universe.

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3 hours ago, Mr. Hoopah! said:

I've enjoyed the gray-areas of all of the characters in Wandavision and this show.  To me that's more interesting than some mad scientist or an alien trying to destroy the universe.

Preach. Everybody but Sam, Agatha and Vision has been painted in shades of gray. And in the case of Sam and Vision, both of them have complications in their lives that make them interesting. You couldn't get this level of characterization in a movie. I had low expectations for both shows but have been pleasantly surprised by what they have produced. I hope hope hope that we get similar attention to detail from the upcoming shows.

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Marvel has had great success with a deep roster of characters that operate in the gray areas and bad guys who don’t always seem like bad guys. It’s one of the things I love most about these characters and stories. I’ve specifically explained that aspect to my kids about X-Men when they mentioned liking Magneto and how he doesn’t seem like he’s just an evil bad guy. I’ve probably talked about it in here before. I don’t want John Walker to just be a villain and that’s not what I expect. He’s just not interesting at all to me and it’s very disappointing.

Russell is probably doing as good of an acting job as he can with the material and writing provided - and I probably shouldn’t hold it against him that his character is functioning as little more than a plot device for moving on from losing Steve. I just don’t understand how anyone can say Russell is doing a phenomenal job when that character is flat out uninteresting to a lot of people. Sebastian Stan has done a phenomenal job on this show and I think he has outshined everyone.

If Walker gets more interesting over the next couple of episodes I will be more than happy to embrace the character, I just don’t see it up to now. I wasn’t thrilled with the first half of Wandavision but that turned out great imo. However, unlike WV, I’ve liked Falcon and the Winter Soldier a lot from the first episode. Walker has been the weak link in the storyline but he’s also just a supporting role with limited screen time up to now. But we’ll see how they spin it. 

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31 minutes ago, Carter said:

Marvel has had great success with a deep roster of characters that operate in the gray areas and bad guys who don’t always seem like bad guys. It’s one of the things I love most about these characters and stories. I’ve specifically explained that aspect to my kids about X-Men when they mentioned liking Magneto and how he doesn’t seem like he’s just an evil bad guy. I’ve probably talked about it in here before. I don’t want John Walker to just be a villain and that’s not what I expect. He’s just not interesting at all to me and it’s very disappointing.

Russell is probably doing as good of an acting job as he can with the material and writing provided - and I probably shouldn’t hold it against him that his character is functioning as little more than a plot device for moving on from losing Steve. I just don’t understand how anyone can say Russell is doing a phenomenal job when that character is flat out uninteresting to a lot of people. Sebastian Stan has done a phenomenal job on this show and I think he has outshined everyone.

If Walker gets more interesting over the next couple of episodes I will be more than happy to embrace the character, I just don’t see it up to now. I wasn’t thrilled with the first half of Wandavision but that turned out great imo. However, unlike WV, I’ve liked Falcon and the Winter Soldier a lot from the first episode. Walker has been the weak link in the storyline. But we’ll see how they spin it. 

We're all entitled to our opinions. Doesn't mean anybody's is right or wrong. It's cool that you don't see some things the way somebody else does. That's expected in a discussion with this many folks.

Speaking of gray, it used to bother me when Magneto's group was called The Brotherhood of Evil Mutants. Who thinks that they're evil? That tells you how far things have come with Marvel (and the world, really) that a construct like "evil villains" evolved into perspective-driven characters with their own motivations for their actions. After all, from Magneto's perspective, the X-Men were the evil mutants and villains to their cause.

Perhaps the biggest problem in the US is the fact that there are so many freaking villains.

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40 minutes ago, Carter said:

 I just don’t understand how anyone can say Russell is doing a phenomenal job when that character is flat out uninteresting to a lot of people. Sebastian Stan has done a phenomenal job on this show and I think he has outshined everyone.

If Walker gets more interesting over the next couple of episodes I will be more than happy to embrace the character, I just don’t see it up to now. I wasn’t thrilled with the first half of Wandavision but that turned out great imo. However, unlike WV, I’ve liked Falcon and the Winter Soldier a lot from the first episode. Walker has been the weak link in the storyline but he’s also just a supporting role with limited screen time up to now.

He hasn't gotten a lot of screen time, but they've tried to flesh him out with the girlfriend, talking about his military experiences, and his thoughts on what it means to be Cap. And we've seen him change how he interacts with Sam and Bucky, from wanting to have camaraderie to trying to boss them around.  We then see him wrestle with the thought of whether he needs the serum to truly be Cap, which predictably goes poorly. But I thought Russell did well with the single line of "They weren't even super soldiers" to show the vulnerability he was experiencing in that moment, having been the recipient of now several ***  beatings, along with being wholly rejected by Steve's two best friends.

Stan has done the best job.  I hope Farveau listens to the fans and casts him as Luke Skywalker, I would like to see what he could bring to that role.  He's clearly improved his craft over the years.

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Russell hasn't done as good of an acting job as Stan, or even Olsen or Bettany in WV, but he's done a lot with the little he's been given.  Given that one of the trailers showed Sam practicing with the shield, I assume Walker is either killed, jailed, or runs off and leaves the shield behind.  I don't have any clue if they're going to set him up as a Phase 4 villain or not.  With Kang, Galactus, possibly still Mephisto/Nightmare waiting in the wings, I don't think it's a bad thing at all to have (super)human villains too. 

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3 minutes ago, Mr. Hoopah! said:

He hasn't gotten a lot of screen time, but they've tried to flesh him out with the girlfriend, talking about his military experiences, and his thoughts on what it means to be Cap. And we've seen him change how he interacts with Sam and Bucky, from wanting to have camaraderie to trying to boss them around.  We then see him wrestle with the thought of whether he needs the serum to truly be Cap, which predictably goes poorly. But I thought Russell did well with the single line of "They weren't even super soldiers" to show the vulnerability he was experiencing in that moment, having been the recipient of now several ***  beatings, along with being wholly rejected by Steve's two best friends.

Stan has done the best job.  I hope Farveau listens to the fans and casts him as Luke Skywalker, I would like to see what he could bring to that role.  He's clearly improved his craft over the years.

Little things can make or break the entire series for me. Vision comforting Wanda with the "What is grief, if not love persevering" line (and Elizabeth Olsen's excellent but subtle reaction) was beyond a doubt the best moment of that series.

With Falcon and the Winter Soldier, there have been several. Bucky's therapy session in episode one. Sam's reaction to Isaiah in episode two (and the whole revelation, to be honest) was great. I didn't think anything in episode three was impressive. Episode four? Almost everything with Zemo. The Dora Milaje's *** whipping of everybody (and Ayo's sheer disdain for Bucky and Zemo). But the two best scenes in the episode were John and Lemar's discussion about the serum and that final shot of Captain ****ing America standing over a dead body with a bloody shield.

I have to believe that the show's going to lose steam for the last two episodes because it's already had its share of high points.

And Sebastian Stan said he'd only consider playing Luke if Mark Hamill called and gave his express blessing to do it.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Mr. Hoopah! said:

Russell hasn't done as good of an acting job as Stan, or even Olsen or Bettany in WV, but he's done a lot with the little he's been given.  Given that one of the trailers showed Sam practicing with the shield, I assume Walker is either killed, jailed, or runs off and leaves the shield behind.  I don't have any clue if they're going to set him up as a Phase 4 villain or not.  With Kang, Galactus, possibly still Mephisto/Nightmare waiting in the wings, I don't think it's a bad thing at all to have (super)human villains too. 

I don't think they introduced him to kill him or lock him up. I'd bet they put him in the Thunderbolts under Zemo's control, which has the potential to go all kinds of sideways every episode.

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3 minutes ago, JayOzOne said:

This looks good:

 

Yeah I'm pretty pumped for the remaining 2 episodes. The tension of that moment where Sam and Bucky face him and demand the shield from him is going to be crazy. Taking in the history of Bucky in particular, who killed the person who created the shield to begin with and was protected by Captain America (Steve Rogers) when the world was against him. And Sam of course being the man who Steve chose for the mantle.

Will be interesting to see how Zemo and the Wakandans story expands, if that ties in with Black Panther 2 and/or possibly a Thunderbolts arc further down the road. I'm still hoping we see Namor butt heads with Wakanda. Sharon and the Power Broker are loose ends that probably will not get tied off by the end of this show and will roll into the ongoing storyline. Have to figure Sharon will play into the Secret Invasion setup at some point. I like how they've left it open enough with her reintroduction for people to theorize that Sharon might be the power broker.

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11 minutes ago, Carter said:

Yeah I'm pretty pumped for the remaining 2 episodes. The tension of that moment where Sam and Bucky face him and demand the shield from him is going to be crazy. Taking in the history of Bucky in particular, who killed the person who created the shield to begin with and was protected by Captain America (Steve Rogers) when the world was against him. And Sam of course being the man who Steve chose for the mantle.

Will be interesting to see how Zemo and the Wakandans story expands, if that ties in with Black Panther 2 and/or possibly a Thunderbolts arc further down the road. I'm still hoping we see Namor butt heads with Wakanda. Sharon and the Power Broker are loose ends that probably will not get tied off by the end of this show and will roll into the ongoing storyline. Have to figure Sharon will play into the Secret Invasion setup at some point. I like how they've left it open enough with her reintroduction for people to theorize that Sharon might be the power broker.

Remember when everybody realized that there was no way for all of the expectations and conspiracy theories to tie in to the last episode of WandaVision? There simply wasn't enough time to throw everything in and the show was like We never said we were going to do all that **** and just ended. I have a feeling that there are going to be a ton of loose ends at the end of this show. Sam might get the shield but I'm thinking it's not going to close out neatly. At all.

We might not even know what some of those threads lead to until future shows and movies remind us about them. That might suck if you haven't watched all of the shows.

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21 hours ago, achilles return said:

battlestar being a genuinely decent guy and character you want to root for makes his death an actual tragedy 

now walker and karli have both killed each other's moderating voices, it's going to make for a great conflict imo

I don't know if I would consider Karli's guy a moderating voice. He was cheering her on and claimed she was the new Cap America because he knew she had to kill people. 

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So there were 12 vials of the serum left. Zemo destroyed 8 of them( I counted) and Walker took 1. Leaving 3 more, two which were seen still in the case and had not fallen out before Zemo started stomping. I feel like Zemo asked Sam about the serum, because he is planning on giving him one.  Zemo acknowledged that Cap was different and not a supremacist despite taking the serum. 

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55 minutes ago, GEORGIAfan said:

So there were 12 vials of the serum left. Zemo destroyed 8 of them( I counted) and Walker took 1. Leaving 3 more, two which were seen still in the case and had not fallen out before Zemo started stomping. I feel like Zemo asked Sam about the serum, because he is planning on giving him one.  Zemo acknowledged that Cap was different and not a supremacist despite taking the serum. 

Zemo probably would have killed Sam if he said he would take the serum. He was impressed with the quickness of Sam's response. I get the impression he's against people capable of being enhanced as much as those who have already undergone enhancement. I wonder if the fact that Bucky was upgraded without his knowledge or consent makes him less of an enemy to Zemo.

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On 4/12/2021 at 4:42 PM, Carter said:

Sharon and the Power Broker are loose ends that probably will not get tied off by the end of this show and will roll into the ongoing storyline. Have to figure Sharon will play into the Secret Invasion setup at some point. I like how they've left it open enough with her reintroduction for people to theorize that Sharon might be the power broker.

I didn't even think about Secret Invasion. I guess that means it's possible this Sharon might actually be a Skrull, which would be interesting. And also make her being the Power Broker not such a drastic break for her character. 

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