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A Clear Message To The Members Of This Forum And Ryan's Contract


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I've seen a misconception, most recently seen in TDWii's most recent post, that if you pay a QB top money, he's supposed to carry the team and get wins in spite of all adversity.

Here's a quote from the post

teams that pay QB’s as much money as the Falcons are now paying Ryan are counting on that player to make up for a lot of deficiencies of which the Falcons discovered and encountered many. What we found out this year at least, is that Ryan is not that type of player.

I made this thread, for one simple reason, and that reason is to point out how much of a stupid and ludicrous idea this is.

Jay Cutler was given a 7 year, $127.6mil deal with $54 million guaranteed. Tony Romo received a $108.8mil contract with $55mil guaranteed. Joe Flacco received a $120.6mil contract with $52mil guaranteed.

These are all huge and expensive contracts to QBs that aren't exactly top-tier, but are franchise QBs.

Would you like to know why all these contracts are so hefty? It's not because they're expected to carry the team regardless, it's not because they have to overcome almost insurmountable adversity to put up at least 8-9 wins, and it's not because they're required to have their best season (which was definitely required in order for us to even touch playoff contention, let along anywhere further than that). No, not any of those reasons.

The reason is simple.

IT'S BECAUSE FRANCHISE QB'S ARE EFFING EXPENSIVE.

Edited by ChickenBiscuit
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I really didn't bother to read all of that text in TDW's post but does someone really believe just because he gets paid 100 mill he has to be some sort of QB jesus and cover every hole on this team and carry it? What is he supposed to do when we have **** players on both sides of the line, a god-awful free safety and seven rookies on defense, with injuries all over the place and no running game?

Oh but he gets 100 million so he's supposed to fix all that with his QB magic. What kind of stoner logic is this?

And no, I'm not absolving Ryan of any blame. He did do some damage with costly fumbles and interceptions but I don't think you people really understand how hard it is to play with those conditions. Any 100 million dollar QB you can name wouldn't have done any better than Ryan playing on this team.

Franchise QBs are hard to come by and I'm glad we locked up Ryan. Just because parts crumbled around him doesn't mean he isn't good for the team. Honestly this year was probably needed to we could weed out all of our problems and make us better for the future. And Ryan is not one of those problems.

He's here to stay. Deal with it haters.

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Yeah, its sad sometimes. Cutler, has a chance to go to the playoffs. Win and you're in and the Bears lose, then hands Cutler a 100 million dollar contract. I'm suprised Romo doesn't trip over his own shoelaces walking out of the house and three years in a row had a win and in playoff situation and lost all three of them. Flacco was never really good and always had a defense to back him up well until this year and his numbers show that.

But on this board, Ryan is supposed to overcome everything simply because of his contract. Nah, it doesn't work like that. If this was basketball, I could understand possibly but not in this game of football.

Aaron Rogers (da god) part of the100 Million QB club can't seem to beat Kaepernick all by himself.

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Yeah, its sad sometimes. Cutler, has a chance to go to the playoffs. Win and you're in and the Bears lose, then hands Cutler a 100 million dollar contract. I'm suprised Romo doesn't trip over his own shoelaces walking out of the house and three years in a row had a win and in playoff situation and lost all three of them. Flacco was never really good and always had a defense to back him up well until this year and his numbers show that.

But on this board, Ryan is supposed to overcome everything simply because of his contract. Nah, it doesn't work like that. If this was basketball, I could understand possibly but not in this game of football.

Aaron Rogers (da god) part of the100 Million QB club can't seem to beat Kaepernick all by himself.

Ehh, Romo is a pretty solid QB. He can throw a few costly INTs, but he has to play extremely well every game in order for his team to win. He wouldn't receive nearly as much criticism if he didn't play for the Cowboys.

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Great post. I completely agree. Like it or not, this is the current state of the NFL. Any starting caliber QB that can provide stability to the position is going to be paid in the $100 Million ballpark. In such a QB driven league anytime a team has an opportunity to lock down a franchise QB they have to jump at it. I would love to find a bargain QB who can provide the same level of production that Matt Ryan does, but that guy simply does not exist.

Going forward, I think the best shot a team can take at getting good production out of the QB position while keeping costs down is to start a cycle of repeatedly drafting 1st round QB's every few seasons and developing them behind their current QB. Then when it comes time to extend the current QB the team is starting, the team moves on to the younger QB they drafted in hopes of developing him. I realize that there are quite a few reasons that this is not a very practical concept; however, if the contract demands of franchise (but not "elite") QB's continue to rise I would have to believe that there will come a point where signing a franchise QB to a contract extension will no longer be practical. I know that we are set with Matt Ryan, but I just thought that I had an interesting concept and felt like sharing it here.

Edited by Mike Kenn
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You guys are not getting where these guys are coming from. Franchise QBs are expensive, but at the same time these guys are getting paid around 20 mil a year. Salary cap is around 123 million, so these 20 million dollar QBs are getting 16% of the total cap. If you were to break it down so that equal parts to to offense and defense(61.5million each), then Matt Ryan would account for almost 33%.

You cannot expect a GM to pay the QB 33%(offensive partition) and still have money left over for 2 stud Wides, Stud TE, Stud RB, and Stud Oline. Something has got to give. For us that has been Oline, but some teams are cutting down out skill guys. Fans and teams are going to expect these guys to overcome whatever deficiencies the team has to deal with to pay him.

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You guys are not getting where these guys are coming from. Franchise QBs are expensive, but at the same time these guys are getting paid around 20 mil a year. Salary cap is around 123 million, so these 20 million dollar QBs are getting 16% of the total cap. If you were to break it down so that equal parts to to offense and defense(61.5million each), then Matt Ryan would account for almost 33%.

You cannot expect a GM to pay the QB 33%(offensive partition) and still have money left over for 2 stud Wides, Stud TE, Stud RB, and Stud Oline. Something has got to give. For us that has been Oline, but some teams are cutting down out skill guys. Fans and teams are going to expect these guys to overcome whatever deficiencies the team has to deal with to pay him.

So then why is the fault being placed on Ryan rather than TD? Do you believe Ryan demanded TD to pay him and nobody else regardless of faults of the team?
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So then why is the fault being placed on Ryan rather than TD? Do you believe Ryan demanded TD to pay him and nobody else regardless of faults of the team?

I do not think anyone is at fault. That is the way the cookie crumbles. QBs are getting paid still. I do think in the future that teams will be more willing to part with average QBs, like Romo/Cutler, instead of paying top dollar. And trade up to get a rookie QB of almost equal ability. or building up the rest of the team, so an average QB like an alex smith can come in a ball out.

Also I think most people know how I feel about TD.

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I do not think anyone is at fault. That is the way the cookie crumbles. QBs are getting paid still. I do think in the future that teams will be more willing to part with average QBs, like Romo/Cutler, instead of paying top dollar. And trade up to get a rookie QB of almost equal ability. or building up the rest of the team, so an average QB like an alex smith can come in a ball out.

Also I think most people know how I feel about TD.

Fair point, I was more speaking in general about placing blame.
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You guys are not getting where these guys are coming from. Franchise QBs are expensive, but at the same time these guys are getting paid around 20 mil a year. Salary cap is around 123 million, so these 20 million dollar QBs are getting 16% of the total cap. If you were to break it down so that equal parts to to offense and defense(61.5million each), then Matt Ryan would account for almost 33%.

You cannot expect a GM to pay the QB 33%(offensive partition) and still have money left over for 2 stud Wides, Stud TE, Stud RB, and Stud Oline. Something has got to give. For us that has been Oline, but some teams are cutting down out skill guys. Fans and teams are going to expect these guys to overcome whatever deficiencies the team has to deal with to pay him.

That is a valid point. I see all these ridiculous contracts being signed by QB's that, let's face it, simply don't deserve them (Ex: Flacco, Cutler, Romo,etc.) and I feel like there is going to be a breaking point. There is no way that this rise in cost for franchise QB's is going to be able to continue with these teams being able to find salary cap space for other star players. Look no further than New Orleans. It is going to be a real struggle for them to find cap room for Jimmy Graham. We are going to need to play around with numbers to find room for Julio. Chicago is in for a wake-up call when it comes time to re-sign Alshon Jeffery. While I don't think it is realistic for these QB's to be asked to carry their teams to victories, I feel that with the money they are asking for there are also going to be high expectations.
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I do not think anyone is at fault. That is the way the cookie crumbles. QBs are getting paid still. I do think in the future that teams will be more willing to part with average QBs, like Romo/Cutler, instead of paying top dollar. And trade up to get a rookie QB of almost equal ability. or building up the rest of the team, so an average QB like an alex smith can come in a ball out.

Also I think most people know how I feel about TD.

I would be surprised to see another team trade up too high to get a rookie QB after seeing the RG3 fiasco in Washington. I still can't believe the Rams have the #2 pick in this years draft. Haha
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Yeah, its sad sometimes. Cutler, has a chance to go to the playoffs. Win and you're in and the Bears lose, then hands Cutler a 100 million dollar contract. I'm suprised Romo doesn't trip over his own shoelaces walking out of the house and three years in a row had a win and in playoff situation and lost all three of them. Flacco was never really good and always had a defense to back him up well until this year and his numbers show that.

But on this board, Ryan is supposed to overcome everything simply because of his contract. Nah, it doesn't work like that. If this was basketball, I could understand possibly but not in this game of football.

Aaron Rogers (da god) part of the100 Million QB club can't seem to beat Kaepernick all by himself.

.

Has Cutler ever won a playoff game? I have no clue. I was just wondering that today.

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I really didn't bother to read all of that text in TDW's post but does someone really believe just because he gets paid 100 mill he has to be some sort of QB jesus and cover every hole on this team and carry it? What is he supposed to do when we have **** players on both sides of the line, a god-awful free safety and seven rookies on defense, with injuries all over the place and no running game?

Oh but he gets 100 million so he's supposed to fix all that with his QB magic. What kind of stoner logic is this?

And no, I'm not absolving Ryan of any blame. He did do some damage with costly fumbles and interceptions but I don't think you people really understand how hard it is to play with those conditions. Any 100 million dollar QB you can name wouldn't have done any better than Ryan playing on this team.

Franchise QBs are hard to come by and I'm glad we locked up Ryan. Just because parts crumbled around him doesn't mean he isn't good for the team. Honestly this year was probably needed to we could weed out all of our problems and make us better for the future. And Ryan is not one of those problems.

He's here to stay. Deal with it haters.

Brilliantly written sir. Common sense prevails for once on these boards

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I tend to agree.. This is still the ultimate team sport - no one man can do it all by himself.

Therefore, IMO, it is also ridiculous that these QBs are being valued this highly.. I know that's the way the market is these days, but dayum, TDWII is somehow right when he expects these $100 million QBs to carry an entire team, because they are pretty much getting paid like an entire team..

I know that's just the way it is, but that doesn't mean that I think that it should be like this. I don't mind Ryan getting a big contract because, QBs get big contracts these days and Ryan is worth keeping. But it is a bit frustrating to watch the biggest investment this club has ever made, not being able to get anything going because of the rest of the team.. There's a discrepancy between the unrealitstic expectations that go along with these kind of contracts, and the results these QBs can actually put on the field when the rest of the team is lacking.

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I do not think anyone is at fault. That is the way the cookie crumbles. QBs are getting paid still. I do think in the future that teams will be more willing to part with average QBs, like Romo/Cutler, instead of paying top dollar. And trade up to get a rookie QB of almost equal ability. or building up the rest of the team, so an average QB like an alex smith can come in a ball out.

Also I think most people know how I feel about TD.

I think we'll see a lot more Alex Smith type trades in the future..

when top QBs will be getting too expensive for most clubs, sometimes it will make sense to buy low on a veteran Qb that never lived up to his potential, put him in a new system and see if you get anything worth hanging on to for the next couple of years..

When it gets too expensive, I think more and more teams will go after that "lower-tier" guy.

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Therefore, IMO, it is also ridiculous that these QBs are being valued this highly.. I know that's the way the market is these days, but dayum, TDWII is somehow right when he expects these $100 million QBs to carry an entire team, because they are pretty much getting paid like an entire team..

A bad QB can completely decimate the entire team. You could have the best WR, RB, OL, Defense, and Head Coach of all time on a team, and if the Quarterback sucks, the whole team can collapse. There's no single Cornerback, Running Back, or any other actual skill position that can completely affect a team. If you have a terrible Safety, you can scheme around him. But if you have a terrible Quarterback, you're effed. So teams will pay the insurance premium, essentially, that entails having a Quarterback who knows what he's doing and has proven he can make the plays.

Edited by Mr. Lubba Lubba©
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You guys are not getting where these guys are coming from. Franchise QBs are expensive, but at the same time these guys are getting paid around 20 mil a year. Salary cap is around 123 million, so these 20 million dollar QBs are getting 16% of the total cap. If you were to break it down so that equal parts to to offense and defense(61.5million each), then Matt Ryan would account for almost 33%.

You cannot expect a GM to pay the QB 33%(offensive partition) and still have money left over for 2 stud Wides, Stud TE, Stud RB, and Stud Oline. Something has got to give. For us that has been Oline, but some teams are cutting down out skill guys. Fans and teams are going to expect these guys to overcome whatever deficiencies the team has to deal with to pay him.

I hear what you're saying, but how do you determine what % of the salary the QB should make.. Probably based on the production on the field.

I mean, if a QB takes up 33% of the offensive partition it sounds like a lot, but these QBs probably also provides at least 33% of the offensive output in games, so from that point of view it might not be the QB salaries that are getting out of hand, but every other position on offense?? At least that argument could be made.

It makes for an interesting dilemma - should you pay big bucks for that great QB and give him noone to throw to, or pay big bucks for offensive weapons with a lesser QB throwing to them?

So far, I think we have struck a nice balance, but it will be interesting to see how Ryans contract affects who we can keep around at WR and TE, especially now that it has become obvious that we need to invest in pass protection to make it all work.

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A bad QB can completely decimate the entire team. You could have the best WR, RB, OL, Defense, and Head Coach of all time on a team, and if the Quarterback sucks, the whole team can collapse. There's no single Cornerback, Running Back, or any other actual skill position that can completely affect a team. If you have a terrible Safety, you can scheme around him. But if you have a terrible Quarterback, you're effed. So teams will pay the insurance premium, essentially, that entails having a Quarterback who knows what he's doing and has proven he can make the plays.

I agree with that, but getting that QB does not completely ensure your team of success, even though that's the expectation that comes along with these kind of contracts.

My only point is, that I think it is natural for a fan to feel like there are certain expectations for $100 million QB in order for him to be worth the money. Expectations including the QB producing significantly better than lesser paid ones, but also having postseason succes, hoisting a Lombardi etc. I think that is pretty natural when these QB contracts are this large, but that doesn't mean that's the way it plays out on the football field, because this is the ultimate team sport.

I think it is easier to become disappointed in your QB these days, as these contracts bring unrealistic expectations along with them. Expectations that this one QB can't fulfill by himself. We just have to remind ourselves that this is just the way the market is these days, and we need to figure out how to field the best team possible while still paying top dollar for a QB, because the QB alone isn't going to cut it.

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You guys are not getting where these guys are coming from. Franchise QBs are expensive, but at the same time these guys are getting paid around 20 mil a year. Salary cap is around 123 million, so these 20 million dollar QBs are getting 16% of the total cap. If you were to break it down so that equal parts to to offense and defense(61.5million each), then Matt Ryan would account for almost 33%.

You cannot expect a GM to pay the QB 33%(offensive partition) and still have money left over for 2 stud Wides, Stud TE, Stud RB, and Stud Oline. Something has got to give. For us that has been Oline, but some teams are cutting down out skill guys. Fans and teams are going to expect these guys to overcome whatever deficiencies the team has to deal with to pay him.

Matt Ryans 2013 Cap Hit: $9.6 MILLION.

Matt Ryan was #4 in the NFL in passing this year, with guys like Tom Brady under him.

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