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Packers of last season is a way better team overall then the Falcons of this season. What is hard to understand about that?

They had a much better D, but we are talking about pass protection and run game support. They gave up 51 sacks. Rodgers took way more of a beating last year than Ryan is taking this year. He was getting blasted every single week and had no run game to help him. In spite of that, he still had an MVP caliber season. Ryan, on the other hand, has completely folded.

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But Marino would win a Super Bowl with the personnel and would get us 10 wins with ease yearly. Ryan, well not a chance. Marino would tell you his biggest asset was his mobility in the pocket. Without it, he wouldn't have had half of the success he had in the NFL. He will tell you that. Why do you compare Ryan to players who are superior to him?

I never compared the 2 of them? I brought up Marino in response to another poster...

And I doubt Marino could win a superbowl with this team, at least not this year. As many have said on this board, the glamor side of football has been handled well (MR, JJ, RW, TG, MT, JR, SJ, etc.) But the o-line and most of the d has been neglected. Its not all on MR, but being a QB comes with "its a team win, its his loss". I dont think he has played up to his level but its the entire team as well.

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I never compared the 2 of them? I brought up Marino in response to another poster...

And I doubt Marino could win a superbowl with this team, at least not this year. As many have said on this board, the glamor side of football has been handled well (MR, JJ, RW, TG, MT, JR, SJ, etc.) But the o-line and most of the d has been neglected. Its not all on MR, but being a QB comes with "its a team win, its his loss". I dont think he has played up to his level but its the entire team as well.

Stop it! Please stop it. Brees doesn't even have our level of supporting cast and he's 8-2 and likely to contend to a ring this year. Marino is better and with our weapons, he would shatter records. This is why I don't like Ryan homers, they completely overrate Ryan to the point they seriously underrate legends like Marino.

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Agreed but thanks to bad coaching on our part they came back and won. Rather then attack with Julio we sat on a non existent run game and failed.

We actually had a good running game in the 2nd half. It was Ryan who flounder badly. SF sat on a lot of Ryan's passes and stop giving Ryan options. They did what our defense wouldn't do for Keap. They forced Ryan to beat them. If Ryan had the ability, we would have blew SF out of the dome like Keap did to GB the previous week.

Edited by The Return of #1 pick
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We actually had a good running game in the 2nd half. It was Ryan who flounder badly. SF sat on a lot of Ryan's passes and stop giving Ryan options. They did what our defense wouldn't do for Keap. They forced Ryan to beat them. If Ryan had the ability, we would have blew SF out of the dome like Keap did to GB the previous week.

Bad play calling is what cost us the game. Smith's inability to adapt or make halftime adjustments led to our demise. Smith's super conservative style of coaching cost us the game.
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LOL, the fans here on this board are so reactionary. Matt Ryan is a good to possibly great QB. He can win us a Superbowl. The problem we have isn't on the field. Whoever scouts our Oline and Dline prospects has let this team down. Partly the prior regime, and mainly the current one's inability to understand what a good productive line prospect looks like. There isn't a QB in the league that would have lead us to any playoff run without a new line in place. We have 1 good Olineman in Blaylock. We have 2 good Dlinemen in Babs and Osi, but both are longer in the tooth than can be trusted long term. Peters is some one we may be able to build around. Beirman is a good player, and Mass has shown some flashes.But, let us look at the track record here:

Baker, Konz, Holmes, Johnson, Reynolds, Hawley, Jerry, Ray Edwards.

I am sure there is more, but that is a good start. We draft skill posistions well, and evaluate them pretty well in FA, But, the game is won many times in the trenches, and we are lacking in both.

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Bad play calling is what cost us the game. Smith's inability to adapt or make halftime adjustments led to our demise. Smith's super conservative style of coaching cost us the game.

He made adjustments. He seen a hole SF made in the 1st half half and we exposed it with our backs but SF made better adjustments. They realized that Atlanta is zoned on Keap and changed their plan to run with Gore and expose our safeties. It would have been okay if our offense wasn't struggling to pass the ball. Ryan needed to be one to make the adjustment, the backs did and it showed but Ryan didn't. The defense was out of fumes and to be honest, it could have been a blow out in the 2nd half but our D forced a TO when SF was at the GL. Our defense gave it their all. Smitty found a hole to exploit for the RB's. But Ryan was the one that couldn't adjust. He didn't have the ability to.

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He made adjustments. He seen a hole SF made in the 1st half half and we exposed it with our backs but SF made better adjustments. They realized that Atlanta is zoned on Keap and changed their plan to run with Gore and expose our safeties. It would have been okay if our offense wasn't struggling to pass the ball. Ryan needed to be one to make the adjustment, the backs did and it showed but Ryan didn't. The defense was out of fumes and to be honest, it could have been a blow out in the 2nd half but our D forced a TO when SF was at the GL. Our defense gave it their all. Smitty found a hole to exploit for the RB's. But Ryan was the one that couldn't adjust. He didn't have the ability to.

Cool story bro.
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My view on MR has changed somewhat as well. First, I've always believed that Ryan was culpable in p/o losses...he doesn't have the "it" factor to be mentioned among the elites and not the guts of a Flacco/Roethlisberger/Eli who have been questioned/doubted.

What changed for me is that I always thought that Ryan was a solid "next week QB." In other words if he was guaranteed another game(regular season) he could shake off a bad performance and come back strong...not so much this year. Ryan looks unsure, shell-shocked, and brittle.

TD is to blame for a lot of our problems, but the security blanket has been pulled of Ryan and he looks as naked as a baby bird. Building a team around Ryan's arm and not the run game is back-firing on us.

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My view on MR has changed somewhat as well. First, I've always believed that Ryan was culpable in p/o losses...he doesn't have the "it" factor to be mentioned among the elites and not the guts of a Flacco/Roethlisberger/Eli who have been questioned/doubted.

What changed for me is that I always thought that Ryan was a solid "next week QB." In other words if he was guaranteed another game(regular season) he could shake off a bad performance and come back strong...not so much this year. Ryan looks unsure, shell-shocked, and brittle.

TD is to blame for a lot of our problems, but the security blanket has been pulled of Ryan and he looks as naked as a baby bird. Building a team around Ryan's arm and not the run game is back-firing on us.

Ryan is at least better than Flacco. Always has been ever since their rookie seasons.

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You are still missing the point. Have you ever heard anybody around the NFL say Ryan was ELITE? By definition, its the best of the best. The best of the best don't always get the most money. The economic of the NFL don't work that way. The best WR to get a new deal 2 or 3 seasons ago is not going to make as much as Julio Jones in a season or two. The fact is that the money these guys get paid goes way up every couple of years. I don't think anybody thinks Ryan is an elite QB. He got paid the going rate for a top flight QB which is what anybody that has shown consistency will get.

From 2011, lets look at the top 10 passing yardage leaders: Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Matthew Stafford, Eli Manning, Aaron Rodgers, Philip Rivers, Tony Romo, Matt Ryan, Ben Rothelisberger and Cam Newton. Those 10 guys threw from 5400+ to just over 4000 yards. If they were free agents after 2011, they would have all received 20 million a year. Now look at the next group of ten: Ryan Fitzpatrick, Joe Flacco, Josh freeman, Matt Hasselbeck, Mark Sanchez, Andy Dalton, Michael Vick, Rex Grossman, Alex Smith and Tarvaris Jackson. Not many of those guys are getting 20 million a year. They don't show the consistency that the top 10 show. So why the top 3 or 4 may be Elite, the next 6 or 7 are going to be paid just as well and just as quickly. Nobody is letting one of those top 10 go.

Good response. I agree Ryan got a contract which placed him among the top QB's. I don't think he has been worth a top-10 QB contract considering his poor performances and sub-par record in big games, especially in play-off games. In fact, not only has Ryan failed to lift his team to a higher level from normal, regular season games, he himself has contributed to big game and play-off losses with his sorry play and turn-overs. I would probably be a lot more sympathetic and supportive of Ryan if he were making about $10 million per year, but not at $20 million considering the "consistency" which you ascribe to Ryan and that you say places him among the very top group of QB's has emphatically not been there in the "money" games. Those are the games that must be used as a measuring stick for the highest-paid QB's, not having an impressive regular-season record against the bottom-feeders of the NFL.

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Civil and rational? You are your ilk are neither.

If people attack your views, it is becasue you are basically an extresmist in your views with no sensible sense of perspective. You see everything in back or whte (invariably pitch black) and refuse to acknowledge the many shades of gray between those positions (which is invariably where the truth lies). Any fair, sensible and reasonable evaluation of our current front office, coaching staff, and players, has to ackowledge and give some credit for the many things that they have achieved in the last 5 years. When you and your ilk simply refuse to do so, or twist or cherry pick argument to downplay or discredit those acheivements to paint the bleakest picture possible then, then you aren't being rational or objective. Your don't want discussion: you just want to spew negativity.

Have you ever noticed that countries with the work "Democratic" in their name ar ealways really undemcratic? The same goes for posters who call themsleves "objective" and "realists".

Thanks for verifying what I said. You are unable to attack what I said, and went straight to the insults. I said "even if" meaning that while some posts are actually uncivil and/or irrational, there are those that civil and/or rational, even if you dont think mine are, there are posts from other fans that are, and that the civil and uncivil, the rational and irrational are met with the same insults. By the way "even if" is a caveat which demonstrates your BS about me making everything black and white.

Even if you think my views are extremist, so what? They are my opinion. Are you conceding that you are unable to handle an extremist opinion without going into the insults? Also I DON'T see everything in black in white. I make a concerted effort to lace my statements with caveats to avoid absolute statements. It is not my fault that you guys read the first sentence and infer the rest. I have to make it a point to readdress what I said because I am often strawmanned.

I have given TD, and Ryan some credit. Even when I criticize TD for instance I will say "other than drafting Ryan, Julio and Weatherspoon, TD has overvalued and reached for his picks". You guys read that statement as "TD has overvalued and reached for his picks", ignoring the first portion of the statement. You claim it is downplayed or discredited. Even if that was true, so what? I am still addressing the issue and you are still ignoring the points. You guys make 0 attempt to make any debate and you reduce every argument to insults.

Did you ever consider that people honestly have these opinions, as stupid as you think they may be, and they are not trolling? Is it ok for people to share opinions that you disagree without being an *sshole about it?

I see the so called "trolls" handle you guys civilly even after you guys gang up and insult and even then you have the audacity to criticize them of stirring the pot. Even if some of the times you guys are correct that the guy is in fact truly trolling the forum, you could ignore him. As some people say "Don't feed the troll". But the homer-trolls just can't help themselves and act like the very people they are criticizing. You guys say threads are stupid and yet reply to them bumping the thread back to the top of the forum list, often posting to it multiple times - and you claim that I am being irrational?

You are actually projecting what you are doing onto me. This occurs all the time.

What you said is extremely dishonest. The vast majority of what you said is flat out lies and I would be willing to challenge you to show your evidence for what you said, because I am more than happy to copy and paste comments by you and your buddies. I can substantiate my assertions.

PS: Countries that are called Democratic are often are democratic. Most people confuse representative democracy with direct democracy. So assuming if someone claims something about themselves, in this case being a realist or objective, is a non-sequitur fallacy. Even if I followed your reasoning, then every time a person, like yourself, calls themselves a "real fan", then we should assume that is not true either.

Part of critical thinking is applying the same rationale to your own statements to avoid creating logical fallacies.

Also the fact that I didnt name names to who was a homer-troll. The fact that you responded to it and taken aback to what I said would indicate that I struck a nerve. If you did none of those things that I defined for homer-troll, I doubt you would even respond, because it would not even apply to you. Your guilty conscience made you respond.

Edited by Objective Critic
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Is Matt Ryan the best QB to ever play the game? No, hes not. Can he be? Probably not. What he is is the best QB in the history of this team.

Yes he is having an up and down season but it happens to everyone. Its hard to win games when the o-line is atrocious, 1 and 2 WRs hurt, TE older and slower, inconsistent running game, a vanilla game plan, inconsistent QB play, and a defense who has maybe 3 players who would start on another team. Weve been killed by injuries and we have a pretty rough schedule.

To single out one player (Matt Ryan, SJax, Asante, DeCoud, etc.) Is asinine. If one bad season makes you question the team, maybe you arent that much of a fan. I know, I know "ive been a fan since day one, blah blah blah" if youve been a fan since day one wouldnt you be excited about the team and what theyve done these past 5 seasons? Its the most success this franchise has ever seen. Its just a bump in the road right now...

You're right it isn't fair to lay the blame on just one player, but when I look at the front page of the forum, I think it's fairly safe to say there are plenty of other players, coaches, GM that are also taking some heat. But as you know, QB's get all the credit win a team wins and all the blame when a team loses. It's that way because QB's are the most important players on the offense, really most important players on the whole team. It may not be fair for them to take so much heat, but it's always been that way and I don't see it changing.

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