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The Pending Government Shutdown...official Thread.


Leon Troutsky
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Hopefully this gets averted by the adults in the party. There's already some signs of melting Republican unity:

Peter King: 25 Republicans May Vote Against Taking Up Spending Bill With Obamacare Provision

WASHINGTON -- Rep. Peter King (R-N.Y.) said Monday that he will buck his party leadership and vote against bringing up a government-funding bill that includes a one-year delay of Obamacare. And, he said, there may be as many as 25 other Republicans ready to do the same.

Nearly all Republican lawmakers flooding out of a closed-door meeting scoffed at the idea of passing a "clean" bill that simply funds the government ahead of Monday night's deadline. Most said the idea didn't even come up in the meeting as GOP leaders put forward their latest plan: to pass a bill that funds the government through mid-December but also delays by a year the individual mandate portion of the health care law. Their bill would also end federal health care subsidies for Hill staffers and lawmakers.

Democrats and President Barack Obama are insisting on a clean bill or no deal. King said that when he stood up in the meeting and urged his colleagues to vote for a clean funding bill, with no Obamacare provisions, it didn't go over well.

"Overwhelming silence," he told reporters.

But while most House Republicans aren't inclined to publicly admit they'd support a clean bill, King said as many as 25 of them may join him in voting against the rule to bring up the GOP bill at all. The reason, he said, is because they are worried about the political fallout from a government shutdown, and they don't want to be seen as having voted to cause it. If that block of Republicans holds, they, along with all the House Democrats opposed to bringing up the bill, could potentially sink it.

"They just feel it's a dead end," King said of those lawmakers, without naming names. "Shut down the government and then get blamed for it."

The House and Senate have been sending versions of the bill back and forth for days. House Republicans keep adding in provisions to defund or delay Obamacare, and the Democratic-controlled Senate keeps stripping out those provisions and sending back a clean funding bill. If Congress doesn't do something before midnight, the government will shut down. As of Monday evening, the bill was back in the House, with GOP leaders preparing to put forward their third version of the measure.

King said he's tired of being "a facilitator for a disastrous process" and ready to move on. He noted that while nobody echoed his call for a clean funding bill in Monday's meeting, some complained about adding the provision into the bill to make health care more expensive for congressional aides -- a move they said was purely political, to show that Republicans are taking a stand against Obamacare.

"They thought it was wrong to make a sacrifice of their staff," King said. "It's throwing red meat to the public, using our staff to get us out of the trouble we got ourselves into."

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Another Republican using more colorful phrases:

Nunes calls colleagues 'Lemmings with suicide vests'

As a government shutdown looms, tensions are rising within Republican ranks.

Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) had choice words for fellow House Republicans who are willing to see the government shut down over their opposition to Obamacare: “Lemmings with suicide vests,” he called them.

“They have to be more than just a lemming. Because jumping to your death is not enough,” he said.

“You have this group saying somehow if you’re not with them, you’re with Obamcare. If you’re not with their plan — exactly what they want to do, you’re with Obamcare. It’s getting a little old,” he said.

Nunes said he would support House leadership’s latest strategy: A bill that would keep the government open but delay the individual mandate for a year. But he said that approach means a government shutdown will be all but certain.

The result for his party? “You guys ever watch 16 Candles?” he asked a small group of reporters. “You guys remember Long Duk Dong at the end? That’s going to be us tomorrow, waking up on the grass, crashed automobile. That’s us.”

The beloved 1980s movie ends with the foreign exchange student passed out drunk on a lawn after crashing his wealthy suburban Chicago host family’s car.

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There are few adults on either side of the aisle. Both sides seem so consumed by political gamesmanship and posturing that they've forgotten why they're in Washington in the first place.

Republicans have had ample time to pick apart the AHC legislation and make specific suggestions for changes that would make the law more effective, but they've missed their opportunity to carry that message to the people. Should have placed more emphasis on the large numbers of government/union Obama supporters who are exempt from the AHC provisions, IMHO. The 'un-funding' effort simply makes them all look like sore losers who are unwilling to do do anything that might make the Dems and Obama look like they've 'won' something.

Wishing voters would exercise their power to vote the entire Congress out of office so we can start with a fresh slate. It couldn't possibly be worse.

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Could someone explain to me why the Congress and President still receive paychecks even though 800,000 others don't? Seems to me that they should be the first ones cut.

Add troops in there too.

Long as the arms of the government get money this shutdown is pretty much pointless.

This is another reason why I would never want to work for the government. Its never good when you dont control your means of income.

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A little compromise? I mean he did delay Obamacare for rich corporations , the same people he demonized the Republicans for supporting.

I mean if it is the law, why does congress get a pass as well?

So you think it's reasonable for him to repeal or delay this legislation in exchange for a 2-month extension of government spending?

I'll ask the same question that I did in another thread - Suppose this were 2007 and Democrats had just taken over Congress. Suppose they demanded a full repeal of the Bush tax cuts and a full repeal of the Patriot Act in exchange for a two-month extension of government spending.

Would you call that reasonable? Would you say that Bush should "compromise" with that? Would you blame Bush for shutting down the government if he said no?

Edit: Now add to all of that the fact that Republicans just LOST the recent election.

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NO MORE DELAYS. TIME FOR OBAMACARE NOW.

I WOULD BE OKAY with delaying Obama care for an actual balanced budget bill for the next few years, but not for a bill that only funds the government for a couple of months. Fudge that BS.

When you take into consideration that all Republicans are "offering" is to fund government for two months, the whole thing just looks batsh*t insane. They've lost their collective minds.

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So you think it's reasonable for him to repeal or delay this legislation in exchange for a 2-month extension of government spending?

I'll ask the same question that I did in another thread - Suppose this were 2007 and Democrats had just taken over Congress. Suppose they demanded a full repeal of the Bush tax cuts and a full repeal of the Patriot Act in exchange for a two-month extension of government spending.

Would you call that reasonable? Would you say that Bush should "compromise" with that? Would you blame Bush for shutting down the government if he said no?

Edit: Now add to all of that the fact that Republicans just LOST the recent election.

Problem is this isn't 2007.

They could have repealed the Bush tax cuts and didn't ....

You're gonna knock the Patriot act with the "most transparent presidency to date" ...

Both are stupid....PERIOD!

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A little compromise? I mean he did delay Obamacare for rich corporations , the same people he demonized the Republicans for supporting.

I mean if it is the law, why does congress get a pass as well?

why should they? they won the elections. if the right wanted obamacare avoided, then they should have done a better job in november 2012

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Problem is this isn't 2007.

They could have repealed the Bush tax cuts and didn't ....

You're gonna knock the Patriot act with the "most transparent presidency to date" ...

Both are stupid....PERIOD!

You're focused on the policy. I'm asking about the process. Is this how policy-making works, the minority party threatens to shut down the government and default on the debt to got a policy they couldn't get in the previous election?

The problem is that too many people are judging this situation based on whether they like the policy or not. This is a fundamental issue about constitutional processes and the policy-making process.

Suppose that Democrats, after taking back the Senate in 1982, had said they would only agree to fund the government for two months if Reagan repealed all of his tax cuts and economic policies. Is that reasonable? Is that how policy should get made?

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So, you support the notion that elected officials don't need to live under the same laws they apply to us?

The "exemption" is a lie. Republicans put in a provision that took away the employer-provided insurance and forced federal workers into the exchanges. Now they want to take away the money that the government has always provided to pay for that insurance. If the Republican amendment had not been added, federal workers would have simply kept getting insurance through their employer and would have "lived under the same laws" as everyone else.

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Here's a good read:

http://washingtonexaminer.com/how-30-house-republicans-are-forcing-the-obamacare-fight/article/2536611

There are 233 Republicans in the House. Insiders estimate that three-quarters of them, or about 175 GOP lawmakers, are willing, and perhaps even eager, to vote for a continuing resolution that funds the government without pressing the Republican goal of defunding or delaying Obamacare.

On the other side, insiders estimate about 30 House Republicans believe strongly that Obamacare is such a far-reaching and harmful law that the GOP should do everything it can --- everything --- to stop it or slow it down. That includes precipitating a standoff leading to a government shutdown. "This isn't just another bill," Rep. Michele Bachmann, R-Minn., one of the most vocal of the 30, told me. "This isn't load limits on turnip trucks that we're talking about. This is ... an extremely consequential bill that will impact every American, and that's why you have such passionate opinions."

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Another 20 to 30 GOP members sympathize with that position but might be willing to compromise, except for the fact that they fear a primary challenge from the Right.

In the continuing resolution fight, it is the 30 most committed members, along with their 20-30 allies in the next-most-committed group, who are setting the House Republican agenda. The ones pushing for a fight over Obamacare, even if it leads to a shutdown, are controlling what the House does.

Which has led to the question: How can 30 Republicans beat 200 Republicans? How does that work?

There are two answers. One, the Republican majority in the House is fairly narrow. And two, Democrats have been extraordinarily unified in opposing GOP proposals.

It takes 217 votes to pass a bill in the House. Republicans can pass one all by themselves, but only if they keep 217 out of the total 233 GOP lawmakers on board. If more than 16 GOP lawmakers jump ship, Speaker John Boehner won't have enough Republican votes to pass any given bill.

That's where Democratic unity comes in. There are 200 Democrats in the House. If they unanimously oppose a bill, then Boehner has to keep almost all of his GOP lawmakers together, or the measure will fail.

The combination of those two factors --- a close Republican majority and united Democratic opposition --- gives those 30 Republicans their power. In a situation where Democrats nearly unanimously oppose a bill, the 30 can make the difference between success or failure for Boehner. If they stick together, Boehner can't win.

That's the Democrats' goal. "Hoyer has done a remarkable job in sustaining Democratic discipline," says a well-connected GOP strategist, referring to House Minority Whip Steny Hoyer. "He says every day, 'If we Democrats stick together, we let those 30 [Republicans] run the House, or have a huge say that they wouldn't ordinarily have.'"

It's been a devastatingly effective strategy, and it has helped create a deep and growing frustration inside the GOP conference. Just look at what a member of the Republican majority told me after House Republicans had taken another step toward confrontation. "Analysts say the Congressional GOP doesn't understand strategy," the Republican said. "I'm like, 'Congressional GOP' my ***! It's 30 idiots who can't get us to 217."

Boehner tries to walk a delicate line within his conference. But the chances are good that in the end, the majority of Republicans --- the 200, or at least 175 --- will take control. If Boehner offers them a "clean" continuing resolution, they will vote for it.

When Rep. Raul Labrador, R-Idaho, one of the Republicans committed to defunding or delaying Obamacare, appeared on "Meet the Press," he was asked whether he was willing to vote for a resolution that funded the government but did not touch Obamacare. "I am not," Labrador answered. "But I think there are enough people in the Republican Party wiling to do that. And I think that is what you are going to see."

When the time comes, lots of Democrats will vote for the resolution, too, which means the final spending measure, when it finally comes, will likely pass with a big majority.

But Republicans aren't there yet. "This is a process that Boehner is going through to get to that point," says the GOP strategist. The speaker has bent over backwards to give the most committed members of his party their say. After another defeat or two, and under the pressure of a shutdown, Boehner will finally turn to the 30 and say, "We tried it your way, over and over. Now, the majority will pass a resolution."

At that moment, the crisis will be over. At least for now.

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I really like the little timer they have on CNN. Acting like this is a big issue. LESS THAN 4 HOURS AWAY!!111

So At 9 o clock when the sky hasnt fallen what will the narrative be? Perhaps Americans might realize these "non essential" workers are surplus to requirements in the first place?

There are going to be a lot of PO'd people who planned vacations to national parks or national monuments that will be closed tomorrow. That's one of the big things.

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There are going to be a lot of PO'd people who planned vacations to national parks or national monuments that will be closed tomorrow. That's one of the big things.

I could probably see this being issue if it was at the start of summer, but at the start of Fall most people are in full work/school mode. It will be an inconvenience, but not too big from what I'd wager.

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