Jump to content

The Possible Government Shutdown...


Leon Troutsky
 Share

Recommended Posts

This is the insanity that is the Republican Party right now - they were pushed to pass an Obamacare defunding bill in the House that is attached to government spending. That faction is now asking Republican senators to filibuster the Republican bill, shut down the government, as a way to "force" Harry Reid to agree to a rule that makes it impossible to remove the Obamacare from the bill, which is opposed by the majority of the Senate. And they accuse Harry Reid of "abusing his power" by having bills passed via majority vote instead of requiring 60 votes for passage.

Good. Lord.

http://washingtonexa...article/2536204

Tempers flare inside GOP as Obamacare defunding fight escalates

On March 13 of this year, Sen. Ted Cruz and 20 Republican co-sponsors offered an amendment to a defense appropriations bill that would "prohibit the use of funds to carry out the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act." With just 45 Republicans in the Senate (there are now 46), and facing united Democratic opposition, the amendment had no chance. "Sen. Cruz and I have been assured that this amendment will fail and Obamacare will move ahead as planned," said Sen. Mike Lee, a co-sponsor. "If that is the will of the Senate, then so be it."

It was the will of the Senate; the amendment failed on a 52-45 vote. But every Republican voted for the Cruz proposal. "I want to thank Sen. Cruz for offering this amendment," said Minority Leader Mitch McConnell. "I strongly support his efforts. … We need to get this bill off the books and straighten out our country. This would be a big step in the direction of achieving that."

Indeed, some Republicans who are vehemently opposed to the defunding gambit today voted for it in March. North Carolina Sen. Richard Burr, for example, has called the current defunding proposal "the dumbest idea I've ever heard." In March, Burr not only voted for defunding; he was a co-sponsor. Another Republican, Sen. Tom Coburn, has denounced the current defunding move as "dishonest" and bound to fail. In March, Coburn co-sponsored the Cruz amendment. Other Republicans — Sens. Johanns, Johnson, Chambliss — who now say defunding won't work were also co-sponsors of the Cruz defunding measure in March.Now, Cruz, Lee, and a few other GOP senators are trying again to defund

Obamacare, this time urging the Senate to approve a House-passed bill that would fund the government after September 30 while at the same time defunding Obamacare. As in March, there's no chance they will succeed; a united 54-seat Democratic majority and a Democratic White House assure that. Unlike in March, the Senate Republican caucus is deeply divided over what to do.

The change has left some of today's defunders bitterly resentful of their colleagues and former allies. In private conversations, they complain that their fellow Republicans were with them when voting for defunding was easy but have run away when everything is on the line. They could force Majority Leader Harry Reid to give in to their demands, claims one aide working for defunding, "if our leadership was on board with this effort and was willing to fight."

But the fight has become increasingly desperate, and the internal debate among Republicans increasingly sharp. Here is the defunders' dilemma. Senate rules require a cloture vote — that is, a 60-vote margin -- to begin debate and then to limit debate on the continuing resolution that contains the defunding language. If Republicans vote to do both — after all, they support defunding and want it to go forward — then after the vote to limit debate, Majority Leader Harry Reid can propose an amendment to strike the defunding provision. The rules allow that amendment to be passed on a simple majority vote. That means Democrats could strip out the language, and then pass — again, on a simple majority vote — a "clean" spending resolution funding the government but making no change in Obamacare, and send it back to the House.

When Republicans who oppose the defunding gambit pointed out what the rules allow Reid to do, defunding proponents called it a "procedural trick" and came up with an alternative strategy: Yes, Republicans should vote to begin debate on the bill. But they should then vote in a bloc against limiting debate. That would stop dead the entire continuing resolution —including the defunding provision — as the clock ticks toward a possible government shutdown. Nothing could go forward. Republicans would then press Reid to adopt a procedure that would require a 60-vote threshold to pass an amendment striking the defunding provision. At that point, if the Senate's 46 Republicans remain united, Reid's amendment could not pass.

For Republicans who aren't part of the defunding drive, it was a jaw-dropping proposal. We're supposed to filibuster our own bill? they ask. We pushed the House to pass a continuing resolution with a defunding measure attached — and now we're supposed to kill it in the Senate? What sense does that make? And even if it made sense, they say, the plan is simply not possible.

That response has caused deep resentment among defunding proponents. No, they aren't proposing filibustering their own bill. "What we are filibustering is a procedural maneuver by Reid so that he will not be able to gut the bill that we want a vote on," says the aide.

"Our demand is for Reid to do one of two things," the aide continues. "Either agree that all amendments post-cloture have a 60-vote threshold, or bring the amendment up pre-cloture. McConnell can demand those things." Translated into less insidery language, that basically means forcing Reid to adopt a procedure that would allow Republicans, if they stay united, to stop Reid from taking out the Obamacare provision.

The only problem is that Republicans, in the minority, cannot force Reid to do that. "It would require UNANIMOUS consent to change the vote threshold," says one aide opposed to the defunding maneuver. "You really think Reid, Schumer, Bernie Sanders are all going to agree to make it EASY to strip Obamacare? Give me a break. And what leverage will they [the defunders] have to 'force' that? They will have just filibustered their own bill and shut down the government. They will be solely responsible for shutting down the government. Why would a single Democrat lift a finger to help them — much less give away Obamacare?"

That's the defunders' dilemma. And with the time passing and emotions running high, the defunding proponents are running out of options. Their new plan strikes other Republicans as sheer desperation. And they still have the support of just a small minority of their own Republican caucus. More than a month ago, Sen. Lee circulated a letter among his colleagues asking them to pledge to refuse to vote for any government funding bill that includes funding for Obamacare. So far, a grand total of 15 Republicans, out of 46 in the Senate, have signed on. It is extremely unlikely the new Hail Mary plan will garner any more GOP support.

Yes, the Republicans who voted to defund Obamacare back in March would still like to do so. But many of them are firmly convinced the new defunding strategy won't work — indeed, that it can't work. This time, when the vote comes, there will be no Republican unity.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 115
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

I mean, this is the third time around in 3 years

That's what happens when a party (the GOP in this case) mainstreams the crazies and gives them legislative power within their caucus. Funny how I've been saying this for years and now even Republicans in Congress are calling out the "dumb" tactics from the crazy wing of the GOP.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That's what happens when a party (the GOP in this case) mainstreams the crazies and gives them legislative power within their caucus. Funny how I've been saying this for years and now even Republicans in Congress are calling out the "dumb" tactics from the crazy wing of the GOP.

I have to agree with you on this. It seems it is getting worse every year, too. Its like the crazy wing of the GOP is still trying to play tug of war even though the rope broke long ago.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The democrats and Obama want a government shut down. They will do everything they can to make it happen. They know that they can depend on a slavish media to go the extra partisan mile and loudly place all the blame on republicans.

They believe this is their only shot at taking back the house of reps and maintaining their control of the senate in next years mid term elections.

Absolutely right. The Democrats want a government shutdown so much that they refuse to trade Obama's health care legislation that took them over a year to pass in exchange for the Republican's agreeing to not shut down the government. Those terrible Democrats, forcing Republicans to threaten to shut down the government and then not giving in to the demands of the Republicans that the Dems forced into making the threat to shut down the government.

Oh, and librals 'n sht.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You can't even accept the truth when it benefits your side. You are perhaps the most closed mind partisan I've seen in a long time.

I'm agreeing with you. Democrats are forcing Republicans to threaten to shut down the government because they won't give up the health reform law that took them over a year to pass and has been in place for the past three years. Just like Democrats forced Republicans in the House to vote to repeal Obamacare 42 times. It's all a trick by the tricky Democratic tricksters to use trickery to force Republicans to threaten a shutdown and a default on the debt.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would too. I'd like to watch Republicans have to live with the consequences of their rhetoric for once. That ought to shut up the Tea Party wing of the party once and for all.

Ha. No way it'd shut up anyone. They'd just have something else to blame on their opposition. Nobody wants to accept responsibility for their actions anymore. It's always someone else's fault.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ha. No way it'd shut up anyone. They'd just have something else to blame on their opposition. Nobody wants to accept responsibility for their actions anymore. It's always someone else's fault.

Oh, they might not accept it, but the rest of the GOP in Congress would send them packing. I love this "Obama is forcing us to shut down the government" nonsense. It's just comical.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh, they might not accept it, but the rest of the GOP in Congress would send them packing. I love this "Obama is forcing us to shut down the government" nonsense. It's just comical.

If Obama was that smart and the repubs dumb enough to fall for it, I think it makes them look worse.

but its amazing the Tea Party has had enough taxes, so they try to shut the gov down and cost us more taxes .

SEriously, who believed their BS anyway?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

HeII, I hope they shut it down for a few months. I'd like to see some shlt hit the fan for once.

I honestly think we will see this happen within the next 5-10 years. One side will finally do it to get their way/prove their point. I think we'll see actual anarchy, not unlike what much of the rest of the wod experiences every day.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And the vast majority still say they are opposed to the so called "affordable health care act". Even the faithful stand-by labor unions oppose it.

A "vast majority" huh? You really have no clue what the words you use actually mean. Also, look at support for the defunding strategy by Republicans. The public is not on the side of Republicans right now. Which is why I would LOVE to see the GOP actually shut down the government. The grownups in the party would finally be forced to tell the screaming fringe idiots to STFU.

Gallup Poll. Aug. 17-18, 2013. N=1,021 adults nationwide. Margin of error ± 4.

"Do you generally approve or disapprove of the 2010 Affordable Care Act, signed into law by President Obama that restructured the U.S. health care system?"

Approve: 41%

Disapprove: 47%

Unsure: 11%

"Some lawmakers who oppose the health reform law say that if Congress isn't able to repeal the law, they should try to stop it from being put into place by cutting off funding to implement it. Whether or not you like the health reform law, would you say you approve or disapprove of cutting off funding as a way to stop some or all of health reform from being put into place?"

Approve: 36%

Disapprove: 57%

Unsure: 8%

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Whos said anythign about a conspiracy? I suppose you believe polls immune to demographiocs and such? Do ypu believe a poll taken on the issue of gun control would have the same results in SanFrancisco as it would in Wyoming?

It's not a poll of San Francisco. It's a poll of the entire country. It's the same polling firms that were accurate during the 2012 election.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That was absolutely the main issue Obama ran on and everyone knew he was running on it. So why did they vote him in if they were all against it?

He really won on the economy. [i just threw up having to agree with Tahuya here.] Health care was part of his platform, and Republicans tried to make it a huge issue in 2012, but ultimately the economy is the single largest factor in determining presidential elections.

My point is that the issue hasn't turned off enough people to vote against Obama or the Democrats back in 2012. He was reelected and the majority of voters cast ballots for the Democrats. So the notion that the public somehow supports shutting down the government or defaulting on the debt in order to defund Obamacare is just silly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share


×
×
  • Create New...