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How Do You Achieve Energy Independence With Oil?


lostone
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How do you get to energy independence with oil when it is privately owned and making record profits yearly? Why would they stop selling to the world market and only sell here? Would this keep our gas prices down?

I believe that we have to switch to a different fuel to achieve this independence people seek, but there is no political will nor any oil corp that would not call the idea anti American or whatever they could to stop the idea from taking shape.

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If we had listened to Carter in the late 70's we would not be in this mess now. And still some people are insisting we should drill more and keep up our dependence of oil. We need to cut the cord eventually with oil and the longer we wait the more painful it is going to be. We should be well underway now but the Oil purse strings keep buying off everyone to keep us dependent.

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If we had listened to Carter in the late 70's we would not be in this mess now. And still some people are insisting we should drill more and keep up our dependence of oil. We need to cut the cord eventually with oil and the longer we wait the more painful it is going to be. We should be well underway now but the Oil purse strings keep buying off everyone to keep us dependent.

Cosign. In fact if we listened to him we would practically be independent of foreign oil now(a la Brazil), and even have enough to export to help our economy.

Jimmy Carter was probably the best president ever.

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Natural gas is the only way to gain short term independence. We have more than we need and wouldnt have to send a red nickel to the middle east.

Don't oil companies own the natural gas? If so, how do you plan to make them take the gas off the world market?

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Don't oil companies own the natural gas? If so, how do you plan to make them take the gas off the world market?

Oil companies wont take it off the world market but by adding natural gas in the mix you would knock the price of oil down on its azz. We also can pipeline (I love that word) natural gas from the site its mined to your house through our infrastructure. Hard to beat the price of delivery.

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The only real way to do it is through taxation to control behavior. Raise gas taxes. Taxing has a way of influencing behavior unlike anything else.

$0.50 per gallon isnt enough? The "evil, greedy" oil companies only make about $.02 or $0.3 profit per gallon. If you want to use force to change people's behavior, why not just pull a gun on them? If you believe that you know better what people should or shouldn't buy than they do, then just ration gasoline and use the police to enforce it. That would be much more honest to your intent.

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$0.50 per gallon isnt enough? The "evil, greedy" oil companies only make about $.02 or $0.3 profit per gallon. If you want to use force to change people's behavior, why not just pull a gun on them? If you believe that you know better what people should or shouldn't buy than they do, then just ration gasoline and use the police to enforce it. That would be much more honest to your intent.

The current gas tax doesn't even cover the cost of infrastructure built to allow for the driving of gasoline cars. So no, it isn't enough. Throw in all of the added costs on top of infrastructure like:

heath issues related to emissions

wars related to securing gasoline

etc

etc

etc

The reality is that we subsidize the gasoline vehicle in this country by a wide margin.

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Funny thing is, the natural gas that they are drilling for here will eventually hit the world market too (via LNG)! There are some really big LNG terminals in Louisiana and Georgia that are ready to import and export LNG. Anyone thinking that natural gas is going to push down the price of oil is fooling themselves!

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The current gas tax doesn't even cover the cost of infrastructure built to allow for the driving of gasoline cars. So no, it isn't enough. Throw in all of the added costs on top of infrastructure like:

heath issues related to emissions

wars related to securing gasoline

Government roads and infrastructure are in terrible disrepair because their funding was stolen for mass transit boondoggles like the light rail line in California that hasn't laid a mile of track in several years. Also note that electric cars use the same infrastructure and tear it up just as much.

Health issues relating to gasoline? Try running every ambulance fleet in the U.S. on alternative energy and see what health issues pop up.

Wars relating to securing gasoline? We get the vast majority of our oil from here in North America. As it turns out, war isnt necessary to secure oil. You can acquire it through trade. If someone is using oil as an excuse to start a war (the last time I heard of this was Germany invading Russia in WWII) then they are lying to you.

The reality is that we subsidize the gasoline vehicle in this country by a wide margin.

We subsidize everything by a wide margin, and I agree with you that it has to stop.

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The USA needs to switch to natural gas. We won't totally be independent from oil though. Like someone mentioned before about LNG. People should be buying stock in that company because it is going to blow up (no pun intended).

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Government roads and infrastructure are in terrible disrepair because their funding was stolen for mass transit boondoggles like the light rail line in California that hasn't laid a mile of track in several years. Also note that electric cars use the same infrastructure and tear it up just as much.

Health issues relating to gasoline? Try running every ambulance fleet in the U.S. on alternative energy and see what health issues pop up.

Wars relating to securing gasoline? We get the vast majority of our oil from here in North America. As it turns out, war isnt necessary to secure oil. You can acquire it through trade. If someone is using oil as an excuse to start a war (the last time I heard of this was Germany invading Russia in WWII) then they are lying to you.

We subsidize everything by a wide margin, and I agree with you that it has to stop.

Mass Transit is not stealing federal highway dollars from the gas tax. That's an outright myth. The money for California's HSR program came from the stimulus, and I might add that virtually none of the billions allocated for high speed rail has been spent because it required some level of matching from the states.

I know this may come as a shock to you, but the entire reason we continue to dabble in the middle east (and have for 40 years) is because they have oil. Oppressive dictators are not exclusive to the middle east, yet we concentrate our efforts there....I wonder why we haven't invaded Africa...

Electric cars account for less than 1% of all cars. In addition, they account for ZERO transport vehicles, which do disproportionate damage to our roads.

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I agree that a need to switch the main fuel to something other than gasoline is badly needed. It isn't that I don't like oil companies but that oil is a finite resource and as demand rises elsewhere in the globe, especially China and India, we find ourselves hopelessly addicted to the resource. We use oil for almost everything, be it fuel, plastics, fertilizer, etc., so I think it would be a very smart move to shift away from using it as a fuel. Develop and cultivate alternatives (you can whine about subsidies all you want; I'd prefer the government to gamble in this area than to not) so we can become fuel and energy independent, decrease oil imports greatly, and then use our own oil (and Canadian, I guess) to make our products and then export gasoline and other such things we would no longer need.

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Because no one has effectively solved the power for price issue. It isn't because of mass oil subsidies, which there aren't, it's part physics, and part practicality. You won't fly a 747 with a battery and a solar panel, nor run the New York City power grid off of wind turbines alone.

Fossil fuels, despite whatever bad side effects you want to assign them, are amazingly efficient and relatively easy to get to market and use.

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$0.50 per gallon isnt enough? The "evil, greedy" oil companies only make about $.02 or $0.3 profit per gallon. If you want to use force to change people's behavior, why not just pull a gun on them? If you believe that you know better what people should or shouldn't buy than they do, then just ration gasoline and use the police to enforce it. That would be much more honest to your intent.

hahahahahahaha

Guys, raising taxes is literally the same as assault with a deadly weapon!

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Because no one has effectively solved the power for price issue. It isn't because of mass oil subsidies, which there aren't, it's part physics, and part practicality. You won't fly a 747 with a battery and a solar panel, nor run the New York City power grid off of wind turbines alone.

Fossil fuels, despite whatever bad side effects you want to assign them, are amazingly efficient and relatively easy to get to market and use.

What if I told you that I could build you a vehicle that carry 4-6 people 500 miles in air conditioned comfort by using 30 pounds of fuel and all for the price of $105? When we can produce those results with some other form of fuel, then we can talk about getting off of oil.

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Funny thing is, the natural gas that they are drilling for here will eventually hit the world market too (via LNG)! There are some really big LNG terminals in Louisiana and Georgia that are ready to import and export LNG. Anyone thinking that natural gas is going to push down the price of oil is fooling themselves!

Lets say you are king and proclaim that America will now make a herculian effort to switch our economy from a liquid gas to natural gas . The automotive industry will be given tax breaks to switch production to natural gas burning vehicles and homes who switch to gas will see similar breaks. In fact, you will be able to fill your car up from your house if you wish. How do you think the ragheads in the middle east will respond?

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Some people on here have convinced themselves that any tax is an assault on their liberty and is unconstitutional.

Its force. Just because many people today are used to it does not change that fact that all crimes, whether they have a victim or not, are enforced under threat of physical punishment. Physical punishment is also used to enforce laws against the consumption of narcotics, for instance, For the same reason that I believe that people have the right to control what they consume in their bodies, I believe that people have the right to keep what they earn unless they are in an a situation where they are facing extreme impending danger.

In the case of the gasoline tax, it is indeed a consumption tax. However, government operates streets as a monopoly. There is no viable alternative to travelling on government-owned roads, so this now becomes a pre-requisite to auto travel in general.

In using taxes to control behaviour, you are advocating the use of force to make people behave the way that you want them to. Not only is the legislation immoral, but to advocate it is immoral as well. If I shake down someone by hiring a thug to threaten them for money, then I am no better than a thug myself. The same goes for using force to compel people to act a certain way. If you want people to act according to your own personal favorite guidelines, then try giving them an incentive to do it instead of threatening them. And try to give them incentives that aren't acquired from stealing from other people.

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