The Premeditation Aspect Of A "bounty" System

[Quarterback]

I believe this article today by Jeff Shultz of the AJC is spot on:

Hello, Saints: NFL violence not same as premeditated assault

12:42 pm March 6, 2012, by Jeff Schultz

During his NFL career, Doug Plank suffered multiple concussions — they didn’t really count back then — five knee surgeries and a spinal concussion that left his left leg partially numb in retirement. He might have played longer than eight seasons, but, as he said, “I made 100 tackles per season. That’s like 800 train wrecks.”

This is what Doug Plank, one of the toughest men ever to play football, the guy for whom the Chicago Bears’ famous “46 defense” was named, thinks of the New Orleans Saints reportedly putting bounties on players. “I can’t believe a coach, a team or an organization would stand behind that policy,” he said. “For a coach to even address something like that with players, like, ‘This is a person we can remove from the game,’ that puts you on pretty thin ice. If this is true, when you make a decision [on discipline], you have to understand that actions like that affect all the people in this business. It needs to be something that says, ‘This will not be accepted.’”

When the NFL disclosed last Friday, in alarming detail and transparency, that the New Orleans Saints maintained a “bounty” program for three seasons, involving “22 to 27 defensive players” and “at least one assistant coach,” I was initially underwhelmed. We celebrate violence in football, at all levels. The bigger hit, the better.

But there’s a difference between rewarding an athlete for an unscripted play and a premeditated assault. Yes, football is a brutal and physical game. Players generally fall into one of three categories: 1) A little crazy; 2) A lot crazy; 3) Waived. But that doesn’t excuse New Orleans defensive coordinator Gregg Williams basically pinning a poster to a locker room wall, reading, “WANTED: Kurt Warner. Maimed. Reward: $10,000.”

Warner and Brett Favre were two of the players identified as targets in the report. Allegations were initially investigated in 2010 but were denied and couldn’t be proven. New information led to the investigation being reopened in 2011.

The NFL’s statement reads like a federal indictment, with bullet points on “payments for cart-offs,” funding practices and the damning actions of general manager Mickey Loomis.

If there is a line between the NFL being controlled or barbaric, the Saints crossed it. Williams and head coach Sean Payton should be suspended for a season. Loomis, who may have lied to both his owner and the NFL, should be out of a job. The team should, and will, lose draft picks. The punishment needs to hurt.

Former Georgia defensive end and Cincinnati Bengals linebacker David Pollack goes even further. “If it’s true that [Williams] paid for Warner and Favre’s injuries for late hits, we need to talk about permanent bans,” he said. Those trivializing this as some boys-will-be-boys offense are missing the point. This goes beyond cheating, like “Spygate.” We’re talking about people’s careers and lives.

It’s significant that even Williams admitted, “It was a terrible mistake, and we knew it was wrong while we were doing it.”

Suddenly, he doesn’t seem so tough.

Plank, former Georgia Force coach and now the Arena league coach in Philadelphia, played for defensive coordinator Buddy Ryan in Chicago. Ryan was alleged to have put bounties on Dallas quarterback Troy Aikman and kicker Luis Zendejas when he coached the Eagles. But Plank said he wasn’t aware of any coach-run bounty system in Chicago, and when he played (1975-82) players didn’t make enough to fund such a system.

“When I played, you got rewarded for the big hit or big play of the game,” he said. “At Ohio State, it was called the ‘Jack Tatum Hit of the Game.’ In Chicago if you made a big play I think they gave you a dinner for two. But that was after the fact. What we’re talking about in New Orleans is more in advance. Buddy didn’t stand in front of a room while we were watching film and say, ‘This guy has to go down.’” Williams did as much. He admits it.

Commissioner Roger Goodell will swing a sledgehammer. Bounty rules, he said, ensure “player safety and competitive integrity.”

Everything else is window dressing.

[Falcanuck]

Good read, thanks.

[jbrinson]

I hope the league suspends Payton since he knew about it. Lets see how the Aints function without him

[Quarterback]

I hope the league suspends Payton since he knew about it. Lets see how the Aints function without him

I believe they are compelled to act swiftly and convincingly. To do otherwise may open them up to potentially damaging legal consequences...it may regardless!

[PapaJoe]

Yup. Good writeup. The Saints have totally screwed the pooch on this. I agree that lifetime ban of Williams is deserved and that Payton and Loomis should be banned from all NFL related contact for at least one season; could easily argue it should be lifetime for both. There appears to be several players that could face same level of discipline (Vilma and Sharper for starters). The organization should get about two years of no draft picks at all and a MEGA-million fine... cuz' the NFL is gonna' need the coin to fund the lawsuits that are going to come as a direct result of this behavior by the Saints.

*** Has anyone heard anything from Heath "I'm a Saint pole smoker" Evans on NFL Network since this story broke??***

[jbrinson]

Yup. Good writeup. The Saints have totally screwed the pooch on this. I agree that lifetime ban of Williams is deserved and that Payton and Loomis should be banned from all NFL related contact for at least one season; could easily argue it should be lifetime for both. There appears to be several players that could face same level of discipline (Vilma and Sharper for starters). The organization should get about two years of no draft picks at all and a MEGA-million fine... cuz' the NFL is gonna' need the coin to fund the lawsuits that are going to come as a direct result of this behavior by the Saints.

*** Has anyone heard anything from Heath "I'm a Saint pole smoker" Evans on NFL Network since this story broke??***

i like the way you think man

[Knight of God]

[ukfalc]

Why aren't more people talking about stripping the Saints of their tainted championship?

The most compelling evidence relates to the playoff wins against the Packers and Cardinals, where they cheated in knocking Favre and Warner or of the games with cheap shots.

The only fitting punishment is to take the title, rings and all bonus monies from the 2010 playoff run. I guarnatee that would stop this dead in its tracks. If they don't then I suspect that most saints players and coaches would say it was worth doing, as they have a world champiosnhip to show for it, even if it is tainted.

[SugarNips]

Why aren't more people talking about stripping the Saints of their tainted championship?

The most compelling evidence relates to the playoff wins against the Packers and Cardinals, where they cheated in knocking Favre and Warner or of the games with cheap shots.

The only fitting punishment is to take the title, rings and all bonus monies from the 2010 playoff run. I guarnatee that would stop this dead in its tracks. If they don't then I suspect that most saints players and coaches would say it was worth doing, as they have a world champiosnhip to show for it, even if it is tainted.

Everyone knows it was a bull**** sympathy championship anyways

Edited March 6, 2012 by SugarNips

[Trouble]

If the NFL drops the ball on this punishment wise, the government should step in. There is no excuse for years of coaching to go out and take people out. That is not about competition.

Saints can deny it. But it was supposedly caught on audio where they celebrated hurting favre and knocking him out the game. Which is supposed to be admitted as evidence against the Saints in this. They may say it wasnt about hurting people. But its become clear that it was.

[Big_D]

The sooner Goodell acts the better it will be.