3-4 teams in need of a DE and WR.

[84White32Quizz]

Who is this team? I know there was a thread about who the Falcons could trade and Jenks was brought up I'm just wondering if there are any teams that we could trade Jenks and Jam to.

The only problem would be the amount of money they make. If there was a way of getting them to redo their contracts I believe a 3-4 team would buy into Jam and if they need a WR as well there is a way of us getting no later than a 4th rd pick imo.

What do you all think? Could we trade both? is there a team that needs both? would they even consider redoing their contracts?

[Knight of God]

Who is this team? I know there was a thread about who the Falcons could trade and Jenks was brought up I'm just wondering if there are any teams that we could trade Jenks and Jam to.

The only problem would be the amount of money they make. If there was a way of getting them to redo their contracts I believe a 3-4 team would buy into Jam and if they need a WR as well there is a way of us getting no later than a 4th rd pick imo.

What do you all think? Could we trade both? is there a team that needs both? would they even consider redoing their contracts?

San Diego Chargers needs a WR and could use a DE.

[Voice of Reason]

People need to understand what "re-doing a contract" means.

It is done to lower a "cap hit" on a player. Say a player is set to make a large amount of salary in a season, but "re-doing" the contract turns that money into a bonus, allowing a team to spead it out.

The reason I'm saying this is because a player can NOT lower his salary. He can't redo a contract for a lower amount. The player's union/association (whatever they want to be called) forbids it.

So, will a team be willing to accept Jenkins at his current pay (because he can't take less)? I say, no. There are far too many quality FA receivers on the market who will demand less.

JA98? Here is where we might get something back. He could prove more valuable to a 3-4 team because a) he's still very young; and b ) not too great of cap hit (compared to other 5 techniques out there).

However, it's always a good idea to have a player on the roster that can swing between tackle and end. Right now, JA98 and Davis are about the only two (and Davis in purely passing situations). I'm not so certain JA98 is more valuable to us than he would be to a 3-4 team.

[Knight of God]

People need to understand what "re-doing a contract" means.

It is done to lower a "cap hit" on a player. Say a player is set to make a large amount of salary in a season, but "re-doing" the contract turns that money into a bonus, allowing a team to spead it out.

The reason I'm saying this is because a player can NOT lower his salary. He can't redo a contract for a lower amount. The player's union/association (whatever they want to be called) forbids it.

So, will a team be willing to accept Jenkins at his current pay (because he can't take less)? I say, no. There are far too many quality FA receivers on the market who will demand less.

JA98? Here is where we might get something back. He could prove more valuable to a 3-4 team because a) he's still very young; and b ) not too great of cap hit (compared to other 5 techniques out there).

However, it's always a good idea to have a player on the roster that can swing between tackle and end. Right now, JA98 and Davis are about the only two (and Davis in purely passing situations). I'm not so certain JA98 is more valuable to us than he would be to a 3-4 team.

Are we even going to have a cap?

[Voice of Reason]

Are we even going to have a cap?

Are we going to have a season? :unsure:

I kid. :P

There is a post on here reporting it will be $120 million or so. But I don't buy that figure for one minute. I also think that was what LaCanfora was saying (which makes it even LESS believable since that guy is freakin moron).

[k-train]

From an article on NFL.com about rookie pay scale agreement & CBA talk progression:

"Also, salary-cap details became clear -- the 2011 projected cap will be roughly $123 million, according to sources, but as a practical matter will "feel" more like $130 million to teams when cap credits and new cap exceptions are factored. And teams will have to spend, in cash, 90 percent to the cap minimum, and league-wide spending will be pegged at 99 percent to the cap."

link to article

[Guest mashburn]

From an article on NFL.com about rookie pay scale agreement & CBA talk progression:

"Also, salary-cap details became clear -- the 2011 projected cap will be roughly $123 million, according to sources, but as a practical matter will "feel" more like $130 million to teams when cap credits and new cap exceptions are factored. And teams will have to spend, in cash, 90 percent to the cap minimum, and league-wide spending will be pegged at 99 percent to the cap."

link to article

Why do we have to spend 90%? Cause there could be rookies we need to resign. Lets say that the new rookie way scale lets us get julio for way cheap. But in 5 years he'll need to get paid more, but we may not be able to because we had to put down 115 million out of 130 million. Meaning we could only give a star returning rookie 15 million.

[k-train]

Why do we have to spend 90%? Cause there could be rookies we need to resign. Lets say that the new rookie way scale lets us get julio for way cheap. But in 5 years he'll need to get paid more, but we may not be able to because we had to put down 115 million out of 130 million. Meaning we could only give a star returning rookie 15 million.

In 5 years we probably won't have guys like Turner, Jenkins, Davis, Gonzo, Ovie, Abe, and possibly D-Rob, Roddy around, so we'll have PLENTY of cheese to spread around to the younger guys when the time comes.

Forcing teams to spend up to 90% of the cap actually helps the players big time. It means owners can't be total tightwads, and it forces teams like the Bengals to at least TRY to be competitive.

[Tribal Chief]

Who is this team? I know there was a thread about who the Falcons could trade and Jenks was brought up I'm just wondering if there are any teams that we could trade Jenks and Jam to.

The only problem would be the amount of money they make. If there was a way of getting them to redo their contracts I believe a 3-4 team would buy into Jam and if they need a WR as well there is a way of us getting no later than a 4th rd pick imo.

What do you all think? Could we trade both? is there a team that needs both? would they even consider redoing their contracts?

Did you mean 3-4 "team"?

[MattM12]

Oh shock, another thread about trading JA98 and Jenkins... move along people

[GEORGIAfan]

Jenkins Cap hit for 2011 and 2012 is 3.5mil and 4.5mil respectively. This is According to Rotoworld profile.

[maxatlanta]

Jenkins Cap hit for 2011 and 2012 is 3.5mil and 4.5mil respectively. This is According to Rotoworld profile.

Exactly. His salary is even less because the cap hit includes prorated signing bonus and any other bonuses he's received.

Now, when a guy who is option number 4 (Turner, Roddy, Gonzo) is putting up 50+ catches per season, and is the best blocking WR on the team... exactly how much is that guy worth? Easily 3.5/4.5 million if they are not old and declining. In addition, Jenkins has been coming up big in key situations the last 3 seasons. He seems to still be improving over time.

My point- He is worth every penny to us. There are teams out there who would gladly welcome him, though I doubt the compensation will be worth us making that move.

Julio is full of superstar potential, HD has shown flashes, we have high hopes for Meir, and Weems is our primary KR. Roddy and Jenks are the only proven WR on our roster; the timing is not right to make that trade. Next year, with Jenks in his contract season, and if our unproven WR have stepped up and established themselves, then it would make more sense.

I also think people underestimate the chemistry between Ryan and Jenkins. HD may be quicker, but that counts for very little when he and Ryan aren't in sync. If Ryan wants Jenkins here, I don't see the FO moving him.

[Peyton]

Jenkins Cap hit for 2011 and 2012 is 3.5mil and 4.5mil respectively. This is According to Rotoworld profile.

Rotoworld reports salary, not cap hits.

Jenkins cap hit is over 5 mil. His salary is 3.5 million. You have to add on to it the prorated portion of the 7.5 million bonus he got on his contract.

[Peyton]

Exactly. His salary is even less because the cap hit includes prorated signing bonus and any other bonuses he's received.

Now, when a guy who is option number 4 (Turner, Roddy, Gonzo) is putting up 50+ catches per season, and is the best blocking WR on the team... exactly how much is that guy worth? Easily 3.5/4.5 million if they are not old and declining. In addition, Jenkins has been coming up big in key situations the last 3 seasons. He seems to still be improving over time.

My point- He is worth every penny to us. There are teams out there who would gladly welcome him, though I doubt the compensation will be worth us making that move.

Julio is full of superstar potential, HD has shown flashes, we have high hopes for Meir, and Weems is our primary KR. Roddy and Jenks are the only proven WR on our roster; the timing is not right to make that trade. Next year, with Jenks in his contract season, and if our unproven WR have stepped up and established themselves, then it would make more sense.

I also think people underestimate the chemistry between Ryan and Jenkins. HD may be quicker, but that counts for very little when he and Ryan aren't in sync. If Ryan wants Jenkins here, I don't see the FO moving him.

If Michael Jenkins was worth his salary, then the Falcons wouldn't have traded away the farm, momma's farm, daddy's farm, brother's farm, and sister's farm to get him off the field.

And you are wrong about his salary. His base salary is 3.5 m. His salary cap hit will include almost 2 mil in prorated bonus.

[Theyhateme : )]

Oh shock, another thread about trading JA98 and Jenkins... move along people

[Theyhateme : )]

Exactly. His salary is even less because the cap hit includes prorated signing bonus and any other bonuses he's received.

Now, when a guy who is option number 4 (Turner, Roddy, Gonzo) is putting up 50+ catches per season, and is the best blocking WR on the team... exactly how much is that guy worth? Easily 3.5/4.5 million if they are not old and declining. In addition, Jenkins has been coming up big in key situations the last 3 seasons. He seems to still be improving over time.

My point- He is worth every penny to us. There are teams out there who would gladly welcome him, though I doubt the compensation will be worth us making that move.

Julio is full of superstar potential, HD has shown flashes, we have high hopes for Meir, and Weems is our primary KR. Roddy and Jenks are the only proven WR on our roster; the timing is not right to make that trade. Next year, with Jenks in his contract season, and if our unproven WR have stepped up and established themselves, then it would make more sense.

I also think people underestimate the chemistry between Ryan and Jenkins. HD may be quicker, but that counts for very little when he and Ryan aren't in sync. If Ryan wants Jenkins here, I don't see the FO moving him.

+1 for you. Very well said. However, football ignorant pundits will be in denial about his value long after he's gone. -_-

[maxatlanta]

If Michael Jenkins was worth his salary, then the Falcons wouldn't have traded away the farm, momma's farm, daddy's farm, brother's farm, and sister's farm to get him off the field.

Salary had nothing to do with that trade(Jenkins is going to make 3.5 million this year). You may be suprised when the season starts. I give Jenkins at least a 50% shot at either beating out Julio initially, or more likely beating out HD for the starting slot position. I also think we'll see Julio get some snaps in the slot(assuming he can pick up the playbook well enough).

I think you are letting Jenkins first few seasons cloud your judgement. The last 3 years he has been money and our offense looked A LOT better with him on the field. Kind of like Drob on defense.

Think back to old skillet hands, that is how Jenkins career has turned around. And just like Finn, it takes a while for people to move past his past let downs. Finn's gone now and Jenkins may very well become Ryan's 3rd down guy.

Why we traded the farm:

*We needed an explosive playmaker. Julio is a special player.

*Our FO realized that a rookie wage scale was likely and managed to make a trade up before other teams fully recognized that top 10 picks are now more valuable.

*As TD stated himself, Julio is not just here to be a number 2WR, he is here as a pre-emptive move so that we have a number one in place when Roddy exits his prime.

[BadMoonRising]

People forget by us having three solid split ends, we may get to see Roddy get in the slot a bit.

talk about mis matches.

[Peyton]

Salary had nothing to do with that trade(Jenkins is going to make 3.5 million this year). You may be suprised when the season starts. I give Jenkins at least a 50% shot at either beating out Julio initially, or more likely beating out HD for the starting slot position. I also think we'll see Julio get some snaps in the slot(assuming he can pick up the playbook well enough).

I think you are letting Jenkins first few seasons cloud your judgement. The last 3 years he has been money and our offense looked A LOT better with him on the field. Kind of like Drob on defense.

Think back to old skillet hands, that is how Jenkins career has turned around. And just like Finn, it takes a while for people to move past his past let downs. Finn's gone now and Jenkins may very well become Ryan's 3rd down guy.

Why we traded the farm:

*We needed an explosive playmaker. Julio is a special player.

*Our FO realized that a rookie wage scale was likely and managed to make a trade up before other teams fully recognized that top 10 picks are now more valuable.

*As TD stated himself, Julio is not just here to be a number 2WR, he is here as a pre-emptive move so that we have a number one in place when Roddy exits his prime.

LOL you think Julio Jones is gonna ride the bench for the next 4 years while we wait for Roddy to tire out?

Ya'll crack me up.

Why would you trade away 2 firsts, a second, and two fourths to draft a guy as an insurance policy?

Show me where TD said that. I'd like to see that quote.

[Peyton]

Since Julio has about 6 weeks to beat out a guy in Atlanta that has been here for 7 years, I'd say it says a lot that you put the chances of it happening at 50%.

If Julio shows up in training camp, Jenkins is gone. The Falcons can't afford 3.5 mil for a guy who isn't going to start.

[Peyton]

I think you are letting Jenkins first few seasons cloud your judgement. The last 3 years he has been money and our offense looked A LOT better with him on the field. Kind of like Drob on defense.

In his first 3 years starting, Jenkins averaged 492 yards a season and 4.67 TDs.

In the next 3 years, he averaged 639 yards a season and 2 TDs.

Dude's not exactly blossomed.

Again, as I've mentioned many times, in 7 years, the guy has only broken 83 yards once. I mean, how much evidence of mediocrity do you need? 7 years doesn't do the trick?

[maxatlanta]

LOL you think Julio Jones is gonna ride the bench for the next 4 years while we wait for Roddy to tire out?

Ya'll crack me up.

Why would you trade away 2 firsts, a second, and two fourths to draft a guy as an insurance policy?

Show me where TD said that. I'd like to see that quote.

What cracks me up is you trying to misconstrue what I said. It's clear you'd rather put words in my mouth to win an argument than reconsider your position.

TD said it in a draft related intv he did. I'm sure the video is posted on this site if you care to search for it.

[maxatlanta]

Since Julio has about 6 weeks to beat out a guy in Atlanta that has been here for 7 years, I'd say it says a lot that you put the chances of it happening at 50%.

If Julio shows up in training camp, Jenkins is gone. The Falcons can't afford 3.5 mil for a guy who isn't going to start.

Flipside: It says a lot about the incumbent when there is any chance what so ever that they could beat out the #6 overall pick in the draft.

I guess we now have something concrete to disagree about. I think Jenkins will still be here and you say he'll be gone. One of us is gonna be right and no amount of spin is gonna change it.

[Theyhateme : )]

What cracks me up is you trying to misconstrue what I said. It's clear you'd rather put words in my mouth to win an argument than reconsider your position.

TD said it in a draft related intv he did. I'm sure the video is posted on this site if you care to search for it.

Vid just posted in another thread that Matt just did with ESPN about the future of the Falcons.

[maxatlanta]

In his first 3 years starting, Jenkins averaged 492 yards a season and 4.67 TDs.

In the next 3 years, he averaged 639 yards a season and 2 TDs.

Dude's not exactly blossomed.

Again, as I've mentioned many times, in 7 years, the guy has only broken 83 yards once. I mean, how much evidence of mediocrity do you need? 7 years doesn't do the trick?

I'm not judging him on 7 year avgs, I'm judging him on what he's likely to do this year. Your stats are misleading because the point I made was that our offense was better when he was playing. It's true, regardless of his individual stats. You know that him missing 6 games last season affected his avgs, that having Gonzo and Turner in the redzone affected his TD numbers. Your stats are only going to be so big when you are the 4th option on offense.

Quit acting like Jenkins is being paid #1 money. He isn't. If you think the front office doesn't like Jenkins then you'd be hard pressed to explain why they extended his contract. They liked him enough to give him that extension and his play has since improved. Basic logic tells you he is valued.