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Being realistic: JJ trade wasn't even close to worth it.


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We got Roddy at slot number 27, so WRs don't need to be top 10 picks.

Be realistic, do you realize that what we gave up would probably be enough to get Larry Fitzgerald? However, I love that we made the move.

It's an odd feeling. The move was not a good one, but I love that we have Julio Jones on this team.

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We'd also have to pay Fitzgerald like 2-3 times as much money, not to mention he has a no trade clause in his contract. Not to mention you can't even trade players right now in the NFL. Plus the Cardinals didn't get a QB so they need the best supporting cast they can provide their current one.

the Saints got Colston in the 7th, so maybe it wasn't worth taking a WR before the 7th?

I'd rather have a sure thing myself

Edited by Dharma Initiative
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in this draft i doubt we would have been able to get anything close Roddy White talent at 27.

in most other drafts you would probably be right.

i just don't see what we could have gotten with those picks(at least the ones from this year, kind of hard to foresee for next season at this point) that would make the kind of impact that Jones does.

and it's not like we are a bad team that needs a lot of pieces. you don't go 13-3 for no reason.

it all remains to be seen. maybe in 3 years we'll say we gave almost nothing compared to how he plays, maybe the opposite.

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We got Roddy at slot number 27, so WRs don't need to be top 10 picks.

Be realistic, do you realize that what we gave up would probably be enough to get Larry Fitzgerald? However, I love that we made the move.

It's an odd feeling. The move was not a good one, but I love that we have Julio Jones on this team.

I don't know how the argument of "this player was not a Top 10 pick so therefore you don't need to acquire a player at that position with a Top 10 pick" continues to be spouted as if that particular position is any different from the others.

Tom Brady was a 6th round pick/Drew Brees was a 2nd round pick - you don't need a Top 10 pick to acquire a QB.

Antonio Gates was undrafted - you don't need to spend a high pick on a TE.

Why do we need to spend a Top 10 pick on a DE - look at Jared Allen! Wait until the 4th round!

23 players were in the ProBowl this year that were undrafted. If anything, your argument supports us making the trade on the merits of you can grab any position later in the draft, so why not sacrifice 1st round picks...but you don't even realize it.

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I don't know how the argument of "this player was not a Top 10 pick so therefore you don't need to acquire a player at that position with a Top 10 pick" continues to be spouted as if that particular position is any different from the others.

Tom Brady was a 6th round pick/Drew Brees was a 2nd round pick - you don't need a Top 10 pick to acquire a QB.

Antonio Gates was undrafted - you don't need to spend a high pick on a TE.

Why do we need to spend a Top 10 pick on a DE - look at Jared Allen! Wait until the 4th round!

23 players were in the ProBowl this year that were undrafted. If anything, your argument supports us making the trade on the merits of you can grab any position later in the draft, so why not sacrifice 1st round picks...but you don't even realize it.

+1... really great point. i didn't even think about that.

maybe cliff matthews will be a huge steal, and outplay some of those 1st round DEs this year. and we'll be very happy with the trade then.

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We'd also have to pay Fitzgerald like 2-3 times as much money, not to mention he has a no trade clause in his contract. Not to mention you can't even trade players right now in the NFL. Plus the Cardinals didn't get a QB so they need the best supporting cast they can provide their current one.

the Saints got Colston in the 7th, so maybe it wasn't worth taking a WR before the 7th?

I'd rather have a sure thing myself

Good points, Julio is the one of the best receiver prospects to come out since 2000 IMO. there are maybe 2 guys you can put above him. Andre and Calvin Johnson. I dont think Fitzgerald was a better prospect, they're even. What did he do with his last top 10 pick? HOME FREGGIN RUN! and he didnt even trade up for that one. The fact that he traded up for JJ should tell you that TD is willing to bet the farm that this guy is going to turn us into what the Colts were with Manning, Wayne, and Harrison.

Edited by #1$tunna
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Roddy White was not NFL Roddy White in college. He was available at 27 because he had 'potential' that was not a guarantee. If Roddy played like he does now while in college he would have been #2 overall. Instead he spent the first 2 years eating Big Macs and dropping passes and coming late to practice (Roddy's own admission).

Julio acts more like a pro than that already, hence he's closer to a sure thing than Roddy was at 27th and hence being drafted 21 places higher.

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We got Roddy at slot number 27, so WRs don't need to be top 10 picks.

Be realistic, do you realize that what we gave up would probably be enough to get Larry Fitzgerald? However, I love that we made the move.

It's an odd feeling. The move was not a good one, but I love that we have Julio Jones on this team.

You're out of your element.

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Key here is "Being realistic." And paying Fitz 2-3 time more? Not if the CBA isn't reached with a wage scale, we'll have to pay Julio what Fitz is being paid.

You've lost this one, just stop. You are being realistic, but not logical. Julio Jones will be a high character Rookie, and a top 10 WR is awesome when you have a good QB. You bring up Roddy White and Antonio Gates. Jerry Rice was picked 16th overall because he was from a small school, and his 40 time. Randy Moss 21st overall because of Character Issues. Fitzgerald was the 3rd overall pick. I am just trying to identify the logic in your statements.

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I don't know how the argument of "this player was not a Top 10 pick so therefore you don't need to acquire a player at that position with a Top 10 pick" continues to be spouted as if that particular position is any different from the others.

Tom Brady was a 6th round pick/Drew Brees was a 2nd round pick - you don't need a Top 10 pick to acquire a QB.

Antonio Gates was undrafted - you don't need to spend a high pick on a TE.

Why do we need to spend a Top 10 pick on a DE - look at Jared Allen! Wait until the 4th round!

23 players were in the ProBowl this year that were undrafted. If anything, your argument supports us making the trade on the merits of you can grab any position later in the draft, so why not sacrifice 1st round picks...but you don't even realize it.

This should tell everybody that the entire draft is a crap shoot. Great players are found all over, so are busts. You have to look at the individual and evaluate their skill set to determine how quickly and how much of an impact player they will be.

There is no magic formula, there is no guarantee, you either get lucky with your pick or you don't. For every argument that someone makes on a philosophy of drafting a position, the opposite is true as well.

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Let me put it this way. You gave up 2 1sts, a 2nd, and 2 4ths for Julio Jones, a WR who has never played a down in the NFL. For comparison sakes, Brandon Marshall was traded for a 2nd round pick, and Anquan Boldin was traded for a 3rd and 4th round pick. Jones may never be the reciever those two are, but maybe he will be, who knows. Honestly though, who would you rather have? Marshall, Boldin, or Jones? Me, give me the proven reciever.

Point being, rookies are overvalued. From the contracts they sign, to the picks you may have to give up to get them. The Saints, honestly, gave up too much for Mark Ingram. But that's just the state of the NFL, you have to overpay to get what you want.

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Let me put it this way. You gave up 2 1sts, a 2nd, and 2 4ths for Julio Jones, a WR who has never played a down in the NFL. For comparison sakes, Brandon Marshall was traded for a 2nd round pick, and Anquan Boldin was traded for a 3rd and 4th round pick. Jones may never be the reciever those two are, but maybe he will be, who knows. Honestly though, who would you rather have? Marshall, Boldin, or Jones? Me, give me the proven reciever.

Point being, rookies are overvalued. From the contracts they sign, to the picks you may have to give up to get them. The Saints, honestly, gave up too much for Mark Ingram. But that's just the state of the NFL, you have to overpay to get what you want.

The difference is Marshall and Boldin can't be traded for 2nd or 3rd/4th round picks right now. It's not like we could've done that instead.

But I'd take Jones over Marshall just for his character.

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So why now? It's not like any of your core guys, aside from Gonzo, are hovering around 35 years of age.

This won't be liked, but what does it say about Matt Ryan? The fact that the Falcons believe he needs two elite guys (possibly, for Julio) to take that next step?

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Why is it assume that we could/can//would have gotten Fitzgerald? The Cardinals made it VERY clear it was not going to happen and with his trade clause I didn't hear him say that he wanted to come here and finally the teams can NOT trade right now. Going into the draft the Falcons had two options give up ONE first round pick next year to get a stud receiver or draft one in the second and HOPE he pans out. If the Falcons had given up this year's 1st round pick then how in the he...ll we draft Jones???? Most people agree the team has depth but need immediate starters. If the team somehow came away from this draft with two possible starters and a very good 2 and 3 down back plus is over 20 million under the salary cap to get a DE or DB how did we sell the farm? We still have our 2 and 3 pick next year and we are not over the cap so please explain again how is the Falcons hurt????

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So why now? It's not like any of your core guys, aside from Gonzo, are hovering around 35 years of age.

This won't be liked, but what does it say about Matt Ryan? The fact that the Falcons believe he needs two elite guys (possibly, for Julio) to take that next step?

i doubt he NEEDS two elite guys, but that doesn't mean he can't have two. and in any logic two is better than one. Colts had Harrison and Wayne. that worked out pretty well for them.

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Let me put it this way. You gave up 2 1sts, a 2nd, and 2 4ths for Julio Jones, a WR who has never played a down in the NFL. For comparison sakes, Brandon Marshall was traded for a 2nd round pick, and Anquan Boldin was traded for a 3rd and 4th round pick. Jones may never be the reciever those two are, but maybe he will be, who knows. Honestly though, who would you rather have? Marshall, Boldin, or Jones? Me, give me the proven reciever.

Point being, rookies are overvalued. From the contracts they sign, to the picks you may have to give up to get them. The Saints, honestly, gave up too much for Mark Ingram. But that's just the state of the NFL, you have to overpay to get what you want.

A first round pick and a second round pick is way overpaying for a running back in today's NFL, who knows if Mark Ingram would have even been drafted in the 1st had N.O not traded back up. Here's the thing, Mark Ingram is going to make your offense really hard to defend. I think its worth it. Same thing with us. (We only gave one 1st away by the way) We gave up an extra amount of future picks but Julio Jones should have the same effect on our offense as Mark Ingram does with yours. Our offense has been good the last few years but if Julio lives up to the billing I think you'll see the offense ATL fans have envisioned. So like you said you have to overpay to get what you want, and if the positives outweigh the negatives why not pull the trigger.

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Let me put it this way. You gave up 2 1sts, a 2nd, and 2 4ths for Julio Jones, a WR who has never played a down in the NFL. For comparison sakes, Brandon Marshall was traded for a 2nd round pick, and Anquan Boldin was traded for a 3rd and 4th round pick. Jones may never be the reciever those two are, but maybe he will be, who knows. Honestly though, who would you rather have? Marshall, Boldin, or Jones? Me, give me the proven reciever.

Point being, rookies are overvalued. From the contracts they sign, to the picks you may have to give up to get them. The Saints, honestly, gave up too much for Mark Ingram. But that's just the state of the NFL, you have to overpay to get what you want.

I agree with you that by and large rookies are over-rated however in this case its not that simple and for the sake of argument lets ignore brandon marshall because there just two many issues with him that are unresolved legally and morally. So if you look at the proven recievers not just this year, but in most seasons who would be available,the likes of boldin and fitz they are similair if not older age to roddy,so we would be left in a couple of years time needing a number one receiver of comparable ability to julio jones,and in reality we would probably have to trade up to get one,giving up some more future draft picks anyway,unless we were drafting low at which point somethings went wrong anyway.

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So why now? It's not like any of your core guys, aside from Gonzo, are hovering around 35 years of age.

This won't be liked, but what does it say about Matt Ryan? The fact that the Falcons believe he needs two elite guys (possibly, for Julio) to take that next step?

Same thing it says about Saints as a whole. Without Mark Ingram, you get beat by teams who shouldn't be in the playoff's because you can't run the ball.

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i doubt he NEEDS two elite guys, but that doesn't mean he can't have two. and in any logic two is better than one. Colts had Harrison and Wayne. that worked out pretty well for them.

Difference in that is that Wayne was the 30th overall pick, Harrison was the 19th pick, and the Colts often draft BPA. There's a huge difference in taking BPA, and trading up 21 spots or whatever the number was to grab a guy. That tells me that the Falcons believe that Ryan NEEDS another guy like that. You don't trade up 21 spots and give up 5 value picks just because you "want" another elite reciever. You do it because you need one.

Not to even mention the needs part. The Falcons needed to upgrade their pass rush, and they had Aldon Smith, Robert Quinn, Nick Fairley, Ryan Kerrigan, etc sitting in their laps. Could have gone after Prince Amukamara to help your secondary, or upgraded your OL with the #1 OT in the draft. But instead, yall selected something that honestly could have been addressed in FA or through a trade.

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