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It's Really Interesting How Some Are Ready to Replace HD83...


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Won't find much of that in this draft man.

Much of what... playmakers?

You're crazy. I like HD and I think he is going to come back strong (started a thread about him) but there are plenty of playmakers to choose from that can play the slot. Just look at most of the WR we are looking at... Ricardo Lockette, Edmund Gates, Jerrel Jernigan, Denarius Moore, Dwayne Harris, Vidal Hazelton, Leonard Hankerson, Torrey Smith, Titus Young, Tyler Beiler. Most of those are explosive slot playmakers. You and theyhateme are just content with the offense we have which is a shame.

And if you don't think Jenkins can be upgraded then the word around camp when HD was pushing him for the #2 spot must have been an intercamp smokescreen.

Harry Douglas challenging for Falcons' #3, and #2 WR spot?

Harry Douglas tore his ACL almost a year ago, so now the Atlanta Falcons want to see this wide receiver challenge for the number three spot. Who knows, he just might challenge Michael Jenkins for the number two receiver position, since Jenkins is somewhat of an uninspiring #2 receiver in the league, so believes D. Orlando Ledbetter of The Atlanta Journal-Constitution. Harry Douglas could provide a very nice slot option for the Falcon's passing game, should he be ready to play with intensity after recovering from his knee surgery. Harry did have a solid rookie season in 2008.

Fantasy Analysis:

I guess I always expected to see more drama on the field with Michael Jenkins. More statistics, more acrobatic catches. I don't believe he has been utilized as well as he could have been, but hey, he's been around for awhile, and simply failed to come on strong often enough to be a constant threat week in and week out to opposing defenses. So, with Jenkins' number two position within reach for Harry Douglas, expect the Falcons to push for his claiming the number three spot, all the while, they are hoping he can produce enough to earn that number two position. Falcon General Manager Thomas Dimitroff envisioned Harry Douglas as another Wes Welker type. Remember that Dimitroff used to work for New England. With that in mind, we add to the mix the fact that Quarterback Matt Ryan has had to focus on short passing routes, up until the opposing defense takes that away. It certainly appears to me that things are being set up favorably for Douglas to exploit his pass catching abilities, and his value this season will be noticed. He will help Atlanta challenge for the division, and then some. All he needs now, is to be medically cleared to participate in practice.

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There is a reason why we are close to, if not, the bottom of offensive plays that extend beyond 20+ yards...and going out to replace HD83 or Jenkins is not the answer. Just spread the ball around....

If you are after more +20 yard plays the answer is not necessarily to spread the ball around.

Ryan has to have more time for longer pass plays. On average the protection is braking down at 2 sec after the snap. Even the fastest WR in the league will only be 20 yards ddown field at 2 seconds.

Ryan need more time. ie better (longer) protection.

Also as FFS1970 pointed out Ryan has a tendency to over throw or under throw long passes so his long pass accuracy must also improve.

BUT I'm not sure getting newer(better) WRs would help without more protection and better accuracy.

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The truth is that HD cannot catch passes through contact. He got the oppurtunity to start with Jenkins starting the season injured. Douglas responded by consistently dropping the ball.....especially when there was contact. Drops passes causes any QB to lose confidence in you. This causes Roddy White to be the target of many throws early in the season.

His knee was not the problem. His quickness seemed fine. His hands are the issue.

I hope he bounces back next year but he needs some competition.

Edited by coachx
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If you are after more +20 yard plays the answer is not necessarily to spread the ball around.

Ryan has to have more time for longer pass plays. On average the protection is braking down at 2 sec after the snap. Even the fastest WR in the league will only be 20 yards ddown field at 2 seconds.

Ryan need more time. ie better (longer) protection.

Also as FFS1970 pointed out Ryan has a tendency to over throw or under throw long passes so his long pass accuracy must also improve.

BUT I'm not sure getting newer(better) WRs would help without more protection and better accuracy.

I think that is due to the fact that we face 8 in the box more times than none so it is a lot easier/quicker for the blitz to get there than when we have more threats on the field making the defense play more honest and less blitzes are sent.

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If you are after more +20 yard plays the answer is not necessarily to spread the ball around.

Ryan has to have more time for longer pass plays. On average the protection is braking down at 2 sec after the snap. Even the fastest WR in the league will only be 20 yards ddown field at 2 seconds.

Ryan need more time. ie better (longer) protection.

Also as FFS1970 pointed out Ryan has a tendency to over throw or under throw long passes so his long pass accuracy must also improve.

BUT I'm not sure getting newer(better) WRs would help without more protection and better accuracy.

Good observation...

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I think that is due to the fact that we face 8 in the box more times than none so it is a lot easier/quicker for the blitz to get there than when we have more threats on the field making the defense play more honest and less blitzes are sent.

I'm sure you are right for some of it but there are other factors as well

ie putting a TE or extra OT in beside Baker for help, usually removes one potential receiver from the field

But if Ryan does not improve his accuracy are they going to stop putting 8 in the box?

If he can't hit the long receiver why worry about the long receiver.

Edited by delaigle
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I think that is due to the fact that we face 8 in the box more times than none so it is a lot easier/quicker for the blitz to get there than when we have more threats on the field making the defense play more honest and less blitzes are sent.

All I know is if you go back to 08...Ryan didn't have the time AND he got rid of the ball with accuracy....

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All I know is if you go back to 08...Ryan didn't have the time AND he got rid of the ball with accuracy....

I think he did have more time in 08, just remember the teams played in 08 versed 09 and 10.

08 was the easiest schedule, 10 the harder schedule, and 09 the hardest schedule.

11 should be the hardest schedule yet.

and it's all relative

ADDED

Hey I'm not trying to knock Ryan I think he's a great QB

AND I'm all for upgrading the WR corp, I just do not think it's a major priority.

I think upgrading the O-line is more important, and I believe they have a good start with the players drafted in the last 2 years.

Edited by delaigle
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I think he did have more time in 08, just remember the teams played in 08 versed 09 and 10.

08 was the easiest schedule, 10 the harder schedule, and 09 the hardest schedule.

11 should be the hardest schedule yet.

and it's all relative

But EVERYONE Blitzed the crap out of Ryan as well...that probably helped him though.

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Ryan has to have more time for longer pass plays. On average the protection is braking down at 2 sec after the snap. Even the fastest WR in the league will only be 20 yards ddown field at 2 seconds.

where did you get 2 seconds from? what's the league average?

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I don't want to replace either MJ is undervalued on the board but he's solid. Also, If we can get a solid 3rd then perhaps we can start using MJ down field where he's truley dangerous and can open up things for Roddy underneath. HD is to full of potential to give up on yet however, he's the weak link at the moment so drafting someone who can compete with him or steal his job seems like a good idea to me. beyond that we have Mierer who could fill in for MJ for a few games should MJ get hurt. If HD gets hurt, I don't think we have another that can do his job currently, after all playing the roll of the thumbless epileptic every time the ball comes your way is hard to do.......JK :lol:

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where did you get 2 seconds from? what's the league average?

One of our posters on this board (TANDY) timed all pass plays for the first 5 or 6 games of 10.

She posted updates here every week.

On average Ryan had less than 2 seconds to get his passes off in those games.

Now there were occasions where he had as much a 4 seconds but the average was under 2 seconds.

ADDED

I do not know the league average is, and I've been thinking about something else that I do not know. It takes a fast receiver about 4.3 seconds to go 40 yards. But when does the QB have to release the ball for the receiver to run under it? ie speed of receiver vs speed of the ball.

Edited by delaigle
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If you are after more +20 yard plays the answer is not necessarily to spread the ball around.

Ryan has to have more time for longer pass plays. On average the protection is braking down at 2 sec after the snap. Even the fastest WR in the league will only be 20 yards ddown field at 2 seconds.

Ryan need more time. ie better (longer) protection.

Also as FFS1970 pointed out Ryan has a tendency to over throw or under throw long passes so his long pass accuracy must also improve.

BUT I'm not sure getting newer(better) WRs would help without more protection and better accuracy.

This works both ways. If your WRs take awhile to get open or can't catch in traffic, you need more time in the pocket (so the receivers can run more double moves.)

Or, if you're not going to have much time in the pocket, you need WRs who will get open quickly, or make catches in traffic.

So, for example, if Plaxico Burress in his prime (or any receiver like that, Vincent Jackson, Fitz, etc.r) were on this team, Ryan could throw it up deep, because he would know that he wouldn't require great accuracy, and the receiver would "go get it." Jenks doesn't do this. Otherwise, you need a guy who gets separation very quickly on a short route, and can create after the catch (a Welker type.)

If you have those receivers, safeties have to back off, and the QB ends up having more time. We need a guy who can create after the catch, and we need a guy who can be relied on to adjust and "get the ball" when it's just put up there. If we can't find those guys, we're going to REALLY need to upgrade the OL. As it is now, our OL is average, and the lack of deep throws lets them put so many in the box it's hard on the QB.

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One of our posters on this board (TANDY) timed all pass plays for the first 5 or 6 games of 10.

She posted updates here every week.

On average Ryan had less than 2 seconds to get his passes off in those games.

Now there were occasions where he had as much a 4 seconds but the average was under 2 seconds.

ADDED

I do not know the league average is, and I've been thinking about something else that I do not know. It takes a fast receiver about 4.3 seconds to go 40 yards. But when does the QB have to release the ball for the receiver to run under it? ie speed of receiver vs speed of the ball.

I think avg is around 3 seconds, and Ryan is 2. This makes a pretty big difference.

On a go route, the QB can throw it after 1 to 2 seconds, and the timing will be right (assuming correct loft). The problem is, the best ways to get open deep are on double moves and the like, and these take longer to develop. On those, the QB needs 3 seconds or so before he throws (and to know if the defender broke on the first move).

Right now, our QB only has time to throw the short routes, or go/post routes. That makes it easy on a defender, because what it means is, you can go all out against the first move the receiver makes. If you don't have to respect the double move, it's pretty easy to cover a guy. Now, if our guys can start faking inside, and going back on a corner route, the offense will open up a lot. That, though, requires more time OR a receiver who will go up and get the ball, so Ryan can throw early, knowing his guy will make the catch (or at least prevent the INT).

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