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The Falcons will never win a Super Bowl until we become objective about our talent level


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Some message board members say that my predictions are "gloom and doom" or show some fallacious reasoning that, since I don't tow the company line and speak up when I see glaring weaknesses,that I am not a fan. Hardly. I can and will take the heat for my opinions as I have since 2002 since I only speak from the standpoint of observation and a hope that by pointing out problems that we all may react as a fan base and in turn get the message to the powers that be. If you don't think that players and some of the Falcons brass never read these topics, you are mistaken in that they listen to radio and read these posts.

Earlier in the season I stated that this was not a Super Bowl team and I will admit that I missed in the victory total (10-6) though with those miracle finishes that record could have been manifested.That statement as I expected was attacked by several members. As it turns out, the talent of this team was closer to 10-6 than 13-3. I maintained that we didn't have enough playmakers on either side of the ball and that notion was scoffed at. Now in the aftermath of the 48-21 debacle Thomas Dimitroff has all but admitted as such. Am I saying that I should be GM as some have sarcastically remarked since I point these things out? Not at all, however it doesn't minimize my nor your opinions and observations if they are valid and will help us win.

Our talent level is no better than slightly above average, as much as many would argue, that is the case. On offense we have only three legitimate playmakers in White, Gonzalez and Turner and no one else is really (and we can pretty much eliminate the Harry Douglas argument). On defense, Abraham is the only real pass rushing threat that teams fear and he is on the wrong side of 30. There is no dynamic playmaker at linebacker a la Clay Matthews and our best playmaker on defense is arguably the diminutive Brent Grimes.

From a statistical standpoint we were middle of the road, finishing 16th in total defense and 12th in offense. Curiously when faced with great quarterbacks and without a pass rush Brian Vangorder went with three man rush lines and two deep zones. Is it the chicken or the egg; did he run these defenses because the talent was mediocre or was he a substandard defensive coordinator? Where was Peria Jerry, who we selected ahead of the aforementioned Matthews? Why was Dunta Robinson a non-factor and less than advertized?

What happened to the Mullarkey mojo? What happened to the reverses, throwback passes, flea-flickers and halfback passes that were the hallmark of his Steeler days? How did the offense slip from 6th to 12th and more importantly, what happened to using the running back as a pass option when Michael Turner ends the season with only 12 receptions?

And what of Dimitroff? With a defense which was in the bottom third, the only change was Dunta Robinson? Some may call this arrogance yet whether one views this in this manner or not it was clear that a pass rusher is more of a need than a secondary player.

When the question was asked about the talent level on offense, he seemed to be remarkedly self-assured in NOT adding playmakers, stating that he had faith in what was in place.

You may choose to lash out at me however you will be missing the point of this. I don't care about personal viewpoints or axes to grind, only to give a thought or opinion that might get someone to consider. I refuse to get into a war of opinions and insults so I will not respond if you choose to be negative. Whatever you choose, the fact remains that if the team does not get another playmaking receiving threat, a bona fide pass rusher (witness the effect of Julius Peppers on Chicago) and a playmaker at the outside linebacker position then we will be singing this same lament for years to come.

Edited by kennycaine
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I will say that we could use some upgrades at certain positions, I think you're not realizing how young this team is. Outside of three players JA55, Peterson (who already has his replacement in Spoon) and Gonzo, everyone else is entering their prime, or on the brink of it.

I agree that we could upgrade the pass rush, but then again I've seen games where we've dominated the line of scrimmage, so to me that is BVG.

I am a little shaky on our LB's in coverage

Turner to me isn't the same back he was, but running backs seem easily replaceable, just look at the saints, Ivory filled in just fine when he was healthy.

We have the rookie WR coming back from injury (Meier sp?) and there's always talent to be found at WR late in the draft who knows, maybe weems can step up. he sure did in special teams (maybe we should keep calling him out :P).

This team is young, and has some play makers, they just need experience and a couple missing pieces to be year in and year out superbowl contenders

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Hindsight is a great thing.What I'm pi**ed at with threads like these are is that the big picture is not being looked at here and how far we have come as a franchise look season 08 to now as Mr Blank promised we are among the relevant teams in the league again and we have put 3 winning seasons together and 2 one and dones in the play-offs.Your right Doom and Gloom thats all your forcasting I'm really confident that the FO and MS will make the correct adjustments with regards to what needs to be fixed and personnel wise.

Nobody said theres some magic trick to this we are 3 years in and I predict what we are doing now puts us in good stead for the next decade plus we are doing things now that in 20 years of being a Falcons fan I have not seen before.Our team is young and will get better with time so I'm ready for the long haul I'm not going get into all this BS about getting rid of this and that I'm all about and confident in what we have installed this off season and beyond.

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While I don't agree with everything, you have given a well thought out argument while stating your case.

The only thing I'm having trouble with is players and brass reading the topics on this board. Players...perhaps I can give you that.

But coaches and management?!?!?

Really?

Really???

Yeah it really is quite silly to keep seeing thees types of threads pop up.At the end of the day we all have one thing in common that everyone should be able to agree on. Our opinions mean nothing , zero zilch nada about the direction of this football team we are fans and nothing more to come on here with all this bs about how we cant win because of x y or z is pointless it acomplishes nothing. Untill you get a job with the falcons and are involved in the decision making precess that is just the way it is know youre role.

Edited by fan72
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Guest AtlWhite84

Yeah we definitley wont win a ring with Ryan he has to many obvious flaws hopefully either this season or next season we trade him for Kevin Kolb

You realize that you're not agreeing with anybody right?

Matt Ryan will never be traded for Kevin Kolb. Ever.

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I think the OP is largely right. It also comes down to how much can be done in a year. Last year I wanted DE and WR, and thought we would go that way. The FO scouted a lot of those guys, and I think wanted a WR, but the draft fell such that a ton went between our first 3rd round pick and our second 3rd round pick.

Basically, they've built a solid foundation, but that's all it is. I'd agree it's around a 10-6 team, but with a solid foundation, no we can grab explosive players and pull them into the fold. It's better to start with the foundation, and they've done that.

It's clear, though, that at WR (as a group), DE and a couple of others, we have some work to do. Even at RB we need more versatility.

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What the Falcons have is a solid well coached football team that beat everybody they should have and a few that could have lost to. There were no bad losses. For a franchise that gave new meaning to inconsistant the first step was build a solid base-three straight winning seasons, accomplished. The Falcons became relevant.

As disappointed as we all are with the Green Bay mess it was delusional to truly believe the Falcons were the second best team in Football. The next step is the tough one to win a Super Bowl. Eagles, Vikings and Titans come to mind, same number of Super Bowl wins as the Falcons.

The NFL these days is to put yourself in a position to make a run. One hit wonders like the Ravens, Saints, Bucs pulled it off. The real long term goal is organizational excellence like the Steelers and Giants and that generates solid opportunities every year.

To dismantle the team because of this loss would be a mistake. The Falcons just need to get better through the draft and solid if unspectacular free agency. The Daniel Snyder method doesn't work for Washington nor did it work in Dallas. The Falcons are headed in the right direction, but next year will be critical. I remain confident but like all fans wary-I don't want to be Jacksonville or San Diego either.

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Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I do not agree at all with most of what you post. I think this team is a few key players away from being the elite team that every fan wants. I also believe that the front office will have those players on the field in a Falcon uniform the next time the team takes the field.

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we have more than enough talent on both sides of the ball but it's being wasted. we got 3 DTs that can penetrate & get pressure (Babs, Peters, Walker, & to an extent Jerry) a pass rushing beast (Abe), a guy that gets pressure (Beerman) & someone who was inactive all season (Sidbury) who should have been getting playing time. our LB corps has the potential to be one of the leagues best & our DBs are all solid except Chris Owens.

I for one have broken down games and shown where we sucked at situational football. I even gave examples & posted breakdowns with photos to support my argument but we were winning so everyone was like 'shut up, we're winning' Harry Douglas has been open all season. Ovie has been open ALL season. Weems has yet to drop a pass when he was targeted. Jenkins was actually very solid this year. I'm a bigger fan of our offensive line after this season considering a lot of what we do, teams already know what to expect. they still somehow managed to open a few holes against 9 man boxes and keep Matt upright. Harry suffered from drops early but he was still open. just imagine if we would have kept going to him gave him a chance to get his confidence back up.

If you honestly think Dunta Robinson was a non-factor then I don't know what to tell you. considering he was playing in a system that worked against his strengths, he did pretty well. I've been against Mularkey since game one when the Steelers all but tried to give us the game. he actually has some good plays but I hate his pass route designs. we need pass plays that get our guys the ball in motion. we got plenty of speed on offense but we're to busy containing it by running out, come back, & stop routes. our receivers barely get YAC. I've seen teams be able to cover our receivers with 1 DB, cause they were in the same spot lol. teams didn't even bother covering Ovie, he should have had about 8 or 9 TDs this season. and you're right, Turner has shown that he is capable of catching out of the backfield, throw him the ball more to open up a whole dimension to our offense.

the only place we're severely lacking is DE. we need 2 studs that can get after the QB because with the talent we have at DT, LB, & DB, our defense will be improved instantly, but we need a PRO coordinator to dial up the scheme. if we can get Charles Johnson, work in Sidbury, then draft another stud DE, and play aggressive & stop all this soft zone crap, we could be solid on offense. but I've said it time & time again, we got plenty of talent on our team, but most of it is being wasted.

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What the Falcons have is a solid well coached football team that beat everybody they should have and a few that could have lost to. There were no bad losses. For a franchise that gave new meaning to inconsistant the first step was build a solid base-three straight winning seasons, accomplished. The Falcons became relevant.

As disappointed as we all are with the Green Bay mess it was delusional to truly believe the Falcons were the second best team in Football. The next step is the tough one to win a Super Bowl. Eagles, Vikings and Titans come to mind, same number of Super Bowl wins as the Falcons.

The NFL these days is to put yourself in a position to make a run. One hit wonders like the Ravens, Saints, Bucs pulled it off. The real long term goal is organizational excellence like the Steelers and Giants and that generates solid opportunities every year.

To dismantle the team because of this loss would be a mistake. The Falcons just need to get better through the draft and solid if unspectacular free agency. The Daniel Snyder method doesn't work for Washington nor did it work in Dallas. The Falcons are headed in the right direction, but next year will be critical. I remain confident but like all fans wary-I don't want to be Jacksonville or San Diego either.

Nice post well put with very valid points.For me it frustrates me that we have so many weak minded fans and are ready to flush 3 years of hardwork which obviously culminated in the poor effort against GB.We are relevant again and are being built for long term success not flash in the pan type deals.The foundation has been laid and seriously for fans to question what the FO and the coaching staff have put together over the last 3 years is plain moronic to me considering what we had in the previous years before.I wonder where all these so called weak minded fans will be when we do crack it will they come full circle its alright to be wary but some of the hysteria I've seen on this board the last 2 days is borderline stupid.

Edited by kiwifalcon
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There are only 2 teams that make it to the Super Bowl every year so statistically you have a 94% chance of being right when you say Falcons isn't a Superbowl team. Conversely, at the beginning of the season they only had a 6% chance of making it to the Superbowl. However, by the season they had an 82% chance of making it to the Super Bowl by making it to the final 6 in the NFC.

To say they need an upgrade in this and that is obvious but not so easy. Sure we need/want a play making DE opposite Abe or a DT that can get pressure up the middle. That could be said for majority of the team in the NFL. Just because we need it doesn't mean we're going to get it. There is the salary cap, and only a limited number of FA that can make an impact. Draft is a crap shoot. And how many teams have 2 pro bowl caliber DEs? Most teams are lucky to have one.

I think TD and the management knows where they need upgrades and know what they need to do more than you ever will.

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"And what of Dimitroff? With a defense which was in the bottom third, the only change was Dunta Robinson? Some may call this arrogance yet whether one views this in this manner or not it was clear that a pass rusher is more of a need than a secondary player."

TD decided that instead of pursuing more players in the same positions - we should give those we have a time to shine. The Front Office believed that Jerry and Bierman would give the push we needed to get after the QB and Dunta would be an upgrade over Houston - which he absolutely was.

The season has proved that it is not enough - so I'm sure we will attempt to add more pieces to this puzzle.

But I understand the thinking - see what you have before you go and try to replace it. Give the defense time to work together - to gel.

We are better this year that we were last year - maybe not leaps and bounds - but we are better, not bottom third. That is all I ask for.

Edited by falconsdenmark
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Yes, Falcons do need to upgrade the talent. My biggest issue is the notion that if you don’t come back with a squeaky clean backgroud you can’t be apart of this team. I called for Mike Williams (WR for Tampa Bay) because I knew this guy had the talent to be a difference maker and would not go in the first round b/c people thought he was a bad apple.

I see a couple of WR like Pitt’s Jonathan Baldwin and this guy DeAndre Brown from Southern Miss. that look like they could be difference makers. I’ve only seem each of them play in one game, but watched a couple of highlight packages and looked at their production. I’m not saying they are sure things, but would not mind taking a look at one of these guys in round 3 or beyond and see if we can hit on a guy. Some of the stuff I’ve read about both of them is that they are “prima donna’s” and have bad attitudes. Our own fans and message boards seem to think these type of guys are cancers to a young QB and a team locker room. Well, after watchign a game like what the Falcons put up aginst Green Bay, and all the over analysls about our lack of explosiveness, I wonder how many would change their opinions.

I want the guys that will help us win games and can stay out of jail. I don’t care if guys say things on twitter or in the media like White did when we played the Saints the second time. If you talk trash and back it up good for you and good for me as a fan. This notion of guys should just shut up and play I think is ridiculouse sometimes. Guys are competitive and vocal at times, football is a game of emotions. If that is part of a player’s make-up, why would you try and squash it if that is who they are.

I’ll take guys like Chad Johnson (in his prime), Terrell Owens (in his prime), Aaron Hernandez, Bart Scott, James Harrison and Aqib Talib any day of the week. You need a couple of these kind of guys to give you an edge. You want the Defenese to put thir foot on somebodys throat and dominant then you need those types of players. Aaron Hernandez looks like a good young player, yet I’m sure the Falcons Filter came up when he was being evaluated.

Edited by isproab
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We went 13-3, we have great talent.

Sorry, the Falcons had every single thing go their way this year including N.O. missing a 29 yd. FG and S.F. fumbling away the winning int. No major injuries to key personnel and they still couldn't do it. Next year the breaks won't all go their way. Look out.

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I've always thought you were a ******.

Thank you. The saying goes that if you cant defeat a person with intellgence you resort to insults. That doesnt change the fact that, ****** or not the situation does not change. And as I stated, your opinion of me means absolutely nothing and that post simply deducted 10 IQ points from you. We need playmakers.

Edited by kennycaine
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Hindsight is a great thing.What I'm pi**ed at with threads like these are is that the big picture is not being looked at here and how far we have come as a franchise look season 08 to now as Mr Blank promised we are among the relevant teams in the league again and we have put 3 winning seasons together and 2 one and dones in the play-offs.Your right Doom and Gloom thats all your forcasting I'm really confident that the FO and MS will make the correct adjustments with regards to what needs to be fixed and personnel wise.

Nobody said theres some magic trick to this we are 3 years in and I predict what we are doing now puts us in good stead for the next decade plus we are doing things now that in 20 years of being a Falcons fan I have not seen before.Our team is young and will get better with time so I'm ready for the long haul I'm not going get into all this BS about getting rid of this and that I'm all about and confident in what we have installed this off season and beyond.

So a statement about this team not being of Super bowl caliber in week 4 is hindsight? I stated incorrectly that this team was no more than a 10-6 team and I was three miracle last-minute finishes off. Pull up the thread and it will confirm this. I stated that, if we got lucky, that we would win 10 games and this was AFTER a WIN. I'm not revising history just trying to get people to stop believing our own press. When Trent Dilfer said that we were the 03 Chiefs who were 13-3 and were throttled in the playoffs everyone was up in arms. Turns out that his objective assesment of our talent was correct. When I state in preseason that we look weak in areas I get attacked. Rather than seeing that these statements are out of concern, some people take things personally and start with the insults (see above comment) Notice that I never insult, only offer what hopefully is food for thought. If anyone feels so threatened as to insult me then by all means avoid my topics. However, all constructive insight is welcomed.

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