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Why not Michael Johnson at 24?


hakim24
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I was anti-Michael Johnson, but my opinion has changed. I always thought he had great talent, but I had some burning questions.

My Reasoning

* We signed Mike Peterson so that takes care of a one starting OLB position... probably SLB.

* Cushing and Curry will be long gone. Matthews has one year of tape and seems to be a huge risk. The 2nd/3rd has some prospects who could be very good in the league. (Tyrone McKenzie, Gerald McGrath, Jason Williams, Jonathan Casillas, & Zach Follet)

* We are on the verge of Signing TE L.J. Smith so that rules out Pettigrew.

* No Safety seems to warrant a 1st round pick. We might can trade up in the 2nd or get one out of the Moore/Delmas/Chung Combo. They all have questions about them and with a big Safety class in 2010, teams might try to fill other holes and we could nab either Delmas or Moore with our original 2nd.

* I really do not feel that any DT/NT fits the bill. None of them have complete games. We can find a good run stuffer later in the draft.

* We could go CB, but there are some GREAT Cover 2 CB's later in the draft.

I honestly think its down to 2 positions.... DE and OT

I think that there will be another run on OT's this year and we will end up with scraps. If for some reason, Oher or Britton falls to us, we really might consider them to finish our Line for 8-10 years.

My Johnson take:

I want somebody to go back and watch the tape of GT games. If you notice, Johnson is ALWAYS dropping back in coverage, being a spy, and doing a bunch of other stupid Bull Sh*t. He hardly ever got into a good rythm of just rushing the passer. Their coach even said that he was their "do-it-all" type player. Now how would you feel if you were a potential top 5 pick and your coaches are telling you to do everything on the field except rush the passer? His stock was plummeting, but he did what the coaches asked for their team. He could have been selfish, but he never complained.

...... he still managed 9 sacks.

His worth ethic has never been questioned. He was one of the hardest working players at GT. He has the most potential out of all the DE's in this draft. What has all of the experts said? He just needs good coaching..... what do we have?.......one of the best D-Line coaches in the game.

some say he is not a "every down DE". I ask again, What is Abe? He doesn't play run downs. What does he get paid to do?..... sack the QB.

Abe teaching Johnson.... Hamilton teaching Johnson.... Some of the best to do it.

What do we need right now? a DE to help with the pass rush some, but give JA98 some room to keep growing.

He is exactly what we need and I think TD is really considering him

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The reason you don't take him is this hit and miss his atheltic ability is unquestioned but I have seen articles mentioning serious commitment issues if you are to take someone like this with these question marks to me its a risky pick where there are other sure fire picks out there without the baggage.

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The reason you don't take him is this hit and miss his atheltic ability is unquestioned but I have seen articles mentioning serious commitment issues if you are to take someone like this with these question marks to me its a risky pick where there are other sure fire picks out there without the baggage.

Every player in the draft is "hit or Miss". The game changes and it is up to the player to adjust.

What has Michael Johnson done to say he is not committed? I saw him sacrifice himself by being Tech's "Do-it-all" player. He could have said no and made a big spill about it to the media.... but he didn't.

He was set to be a top 5 pick and it didn't work that way because he had to do a bunch of things on defense that he would never do in the NFL. That shows commitment to his team.

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I agree 100%. I believe that with our FA signing, Mike Peterson specfically we have given ourselves some wiggle room in the draft. WE need to get to the QB, we couldnt do that consistently last year which really hurt us. I think that based on where we pick in the draft and the lack of superstar defensive draft prospects it is a good possibility that we may choose MJ. I feel that the only pick that would have a impact in their first year would be a OT (Maybe push Clabo back to Gaurd) or a DE. If it is a DE, it would be between English or MJ, and i would rather have MJ, IMO.

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I've seen quite a few GT games, and MJ is not all that. You say Matthews (who I also wouldn't touch in round 1), only has 1 year of tape, well, at least that's pretty good tape. MJ has 2 years of average-to-poor tape, which is better? MJ gets washed out too often, he's handled 1-on-1 by college RIGHT tackles. I saw a lot of GT putting him in different locations, left side, right side, off the line, towards the middle of the line, and he's handled way too much.

He's got the athletic ability and the workout numbers, but something is just not there. He's going to be at best a specialist on a defense and that's not what we need right now with our 1st round pick.

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I've seen quite a few GT games, and MJ is not all that. You say Matthews (who I also wouldn't touch in round 1), only has 1 year of tape, well, at least that's pretty good tape. MJ has 2 years of average-to-poor tape, which is better? MJ gets washed out too often, he's handled 1-on-1 by college RIGHT tackles. I saw a lot of GT putting him in different locations, left side, right side, off the line, towards the middle of the line, and he's handled way too much.

He's got the athletic ability and the workout numbers, but something is just not there. He's going to be at best a specialist on a defense and that's not what we need right now with our 1st round pick.

I think that we need pressure on the QB. Since you dont think that we need a DE, whether it is MJ or not, Who or what do you think that we need with our #1 pick.

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I agree 100%. I believe that with our FA signing, Mike Peterson specfically we have given ourselves some wiggle room in the draft. WE need to get to the QB, we couldnt do that consistently last year which really hurt us. I think that based on where we pick in the draft and the lack of superstar defensive draft prospects it is a good possibility that we may choose MJ. I feel that the only pick that would have a impact in their first year would be a OT (Maybe push Clabo back to Gaurd) or a DE. If it is a DE, it would be between English or MJ, and i would rather have MJ, IMO.

And we all know that MJ's potential is higher than any other DE in the draft.

If we didn't have the coaching staff that we have now, I would be totally against drafting MJ. With Hamilton and Abe giving tips and JA98 telling him what not to do ;), I think MJ can reach his full potential.

Abe and Johnson will wreak havoc on a QB and take some pressure off of our secondary..... exactly what we need.

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i see why you might want MJ, but i just think that larry english is a safer pick for us with more down the line potential to be more of an "every down" de like abe is at times for us. obviously we rotate him out and try to save him more for passing downs, but he does play run downs too. english would come in and just like MJ he would improve our pass rush immediately. however, he reminds me a lot of abe and i think with him mentoring him and hamilton coaching him he could really develop into something special in a couple years. i just dont think MJ has the motor english does and i havent seen him put for the consistent effort that english does when i watch game tape. he stands around a lot and doesnt chase down the plays from behind much, and that just supports my opinion that he has an inconsistent motor. and that makes me think that he is another guy with tons of talent that wont maximize it because he doesnt go 110% on every play like english or other guys that arent 6'6", 265 with great edge quickness do. english, imo, could end up being an abraham/freeney type pass rusher for us and that is why i want him at #24.

and i seem to remember a lot of people on this board being against english because he was a "situational" player. but now everyone seems to be coming around on MJ despite the fact that he would only provide a boost to the pass rush as a rookie and he might not even develop into a 10 sack pass rusher like i think english will.

i just find that funny.

-Mr. Offseason

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And we all know that MJ's potential is higher than any other DE in the draft.

If we didn't have the coaching staff that we have now, I would be totally against drafting MJ. With Hamilton and Abe giving tips and JA98 telling him what not to do ;), I think MJ can reach his full potential.

Abe and Johnson will wreak havoc on a QB and take some pressure off of our secondary..... exactly what we need.

Yeah the thought of those two on the end will scare alot of teams. I hope that A. he is availabe when we pick and B. the FO picks him. But if they dont then I know they know what they are doing.

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I've seen quite a few GT games, and MJ is not all that. You say Matthews (who I also wouldn't touch in round 1), only has 1 year of tape, well, at least that's pretty good tape. MJ has 2 years of average-to-poor tape, which is better? MJ gets washed out too often, he's handled 1-on-1 by college RIGHT tackles. I saw a lot of GT putting him in different locations, left side, right side, off the line, towards the middle of the line, and he's handled way too much.

He's got the athletic ability and the workout numbers, but something is just not there. He's going to be at best a specialist on a defense and that's not what we need right now with our 1st round pick.

9 sacks is average to poor?

So if you have watched a bunch of GT games, have you seen how the coaches have him doing things like covering TE's and dropping in coverage about every 3 plays?

He doesn't even get a chance to get in a rhythm of rushing the passer because he was asked to drop in coverage so much. Abe gets washed out a bunch too. What we need from MJ is the ability to get to the passer.... he has that.

Yes, He needs to work on his lower body strength, but that is very reachable goal. The main thing that we need is somebody to help Abe rush the passer.

We do not need an "Every Down DE" at this point because JA98 still needs room to grow. MJ is exactly what we need.... a guy who can rush the passer now, and transform into a full time DE later.

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i see why you might want MJ, but i just think that larry english is a safer pick for us with more down the line potential to be more of an "every down" de like abe is at times for us. obviously we rotate him out and try to save him more for passing downs, but he does play run downs too. english would come in and just like MJ he would improve our pass rush immediately. however, he reminds me a lot of abe and i think with him mentoring him and hamilton coaching him he could really develop into something special in a couple years. i just dont think MJ has the motor english does and i havent seen him put for the consistent effort that english does when i watch game tape. he stands around a lot and doesnt chase down the plays from behind much, and that just supports my opinion that he has an inconsistent motor. and that makes me think that he is another guy with tons of talent that wont maximize it because he doesnt go 110% on every play like english or other guys that arent 6'6", 265 with great edge quickness do. english, imo, could end up being an abraham/freeney type pass rusher for us and that is why i want him at #24.

and i seem to remember a lot of people on this board being against english because he was a "situational" player. but now everyone seems to be coming around on MJ despite the fact that he would only provide a boost to the pass rush as a rookie and he might not even develop into a 10 sack pass rusher like i think english will.

i just find that funny.

-Mr. Offseason

I know at first i didnt want another situational pass rusher, but i realized that is exactly what we need as we develop them into a Every down DE. I really wanted Ayers to play LDE because i thought we were going to lose Davis, but when we resigned him i change my thoughts about DE. Then we went out and signed MP, which move LB down my position of immediate need. I will admit i was with English until I found out that the NFL website had him listed incorretly at 274, but I have come around to getting a situational pass rusher with the 24th pick. Honestly I dont mind having English, i would just rather have MJ. I will be fine either way.

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can you guys imagine having 2 stellar DEs lining up? it has it effects similar to having 2 capable DT. it will almost be like cheating. perhaps this is the approach the falcons have in mind. and as mention, grab a run stuffing NT in the later rounds.

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I think that we need pressure on the QB. Since you dont think that we need a DE, whether it is MJ or not, Who or what do you think that we need with our #1 pick.

Didn't say we don't need a DE that can rush the passer. What I'm saying is we don't need to use our 1st round pick on a situational pass rusher only. We're not that good yet with enough depth to allow us to take a player like that. There are several ways we could go with our 1st round pick & not have them be depth only. Safety, Corner, & OLB for sure, depending on who falls maybe another position as well.

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Didn't say we don't need a DE that can rush the passer. What I'm saying is we don't need to use our 1st round pick on a situational pass rusher only. We're not that good yet with enough depth to allow us to take a player like that. There are several ways we could go with our 1st round pick & not have them be depth only. Safety, Corner, & OLB for sure, depending on who falls maybe another position as well.

It would really depend on who fell to us. I just figured since we pick at 24, we may miss out on the superstars that can come in and start immediately.

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i see why you might want MJ, but i just think that larry english is a safer pick for us with more down the line potential to be more of an "every down" de like abe is at times for us. obviously we rotate him out and try to save him more for passing downs, but he does play run downs too. english would come in and just like MJ he would improve our pass rush immediately. however, he reminds me a lot of abe and i think with him mentoring him and hamilton coaching him he could really develop into something special in a couple years. i just dont think MJ has the motor english does and i havent seen him put for the consistent effort that english does when i watch game tape. he stands around a lot and doesnt chase down the plays from behind much, and that just supports my opinion that he has an inconsistent motor. and that makes me think that he is another guy with tons of talent that wont maximize it because he doesnt go 110% on every play like english or other guys that arent 6'6", 265 with great edge quickness do. english, imo, could end up being an abraham/freeney type pass rusher for us and that is why i want him at #24.

and i seem to remember a lot of people on this board being against english because he was a "situational" player. but now everyone seems to be coming around on MJ despite the fact that he would only provide a boost to the pass rush as a rookie and he might not even develop into a 10 sack pass rusher like i think english will.

i just find that funny.

-Mr. Offseason

It seems like your biggest knock on him is his motor.... I can see that, but look at it from his view.

He was a potential Top 5 pick and because of how the coaches used him, he dropped all the way down to the end of round 1 or early 2nd. That is very disappointing and deflating. Did he complain? No. He went out and tried to do what the coaches asked.

I know you didn't really see him chasing down players from behind. I noticed it too, but think about how much money he was losing by being out in coverage and playing as a spy every 3 plays... on a non-contending team. That is disappointing and even though he SHOULD be chasing down those players, I can understand how he might have felt about not being able to show the scouts his best asset.

English has a great motor and I wouldn't be mad if we took him, but I still think MJ has a much higher ceiling than him. We have GREAT coaches who will help him reach his potential and that is the biggest reason why I would be happy if we got him.

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Didn't say we don't need a DE that can rush the passer. What I'm saying is we don't need to use our 1st round pick on a situational pass rusher only. We're not that good yet with enough depth to allow us to take a player like that. There are several ways we could go with our 1st round pick & not have them be depth only. Safety, Corner, & OLB for sure, depending on who falls maybe another position as well.

Abe is almost a situational pass rusher only. He plays run downs every now and then, but he is almost exclusively a pass rusher. A situational pass rusher can contribute the same or more than an every Down player.

They are fresher and can impact the game much better without the fatigue. I could really see us with a Line up of Davis/JA98 on run downs and Abe/MJ or English on pass downs.

They all will stay fresh and be more effective.... I think that is the goal.

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9 sacks is average to poor?

So if you have watched a bunch of GT games, have you seen how the coaches have him doing things like covering TE's and dropping in coverage about every 3 plays?

He doesn't even get a chance to get in a rhythm of rushing the passer because he was asked to drop in coverage so much. Abe gets washed out a bunch too. What we need from MJ is the ability to get to the passer.... he has that.

Yes, He needs to work on his lower body strength, but that is very reachable goal. The main thing that we need is somebody to help Abe rush the passer.

We do not need an "Every Down DE" at this point because JA98 still needs room to grow. MJ is exactly what we need.... a guy who can rush the passer now, and transform into a full time DE later.

When was MJ a dominant force in a game? Ok, outside of the Gardner Webb game, when did he dominate? Yes he dropped into coverage a decent amount, which shows his ability there, but I don't buy that he wasn't able to get into a rhythm rushing. It looked like a lack of consistent effort to me. But that's JMO.

IF MJ is going to have a chance to be an every down player, it's going to be as a 3-4 rush OLB, but even that is iffy.

I really don't have a problem with MJ in round 2 at our pick, its using our 1st rounder on him. We need just don't have the luxury of drafting a 1 down DE in the 1st round. I agree that we need a pass rushing DE, but we have other problems that need to be fixed as well in the draft, and those are problems that are not just 3rd down problems, but 1st, 2nd & 3rd down problems. That's my biggest issue with us considering him. There are teams that could afford to do it, but they are teams with solid starters & depth at most positions & have a need for a pass rusher. We are not one of those teams.

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Abe is almost a situational pass rusher only. He plays run downs every now and then, but he is almost exclusively a pass rusher. A situational pass rusher can contribute the same or more than an every Down player.

They are fresher and can impact the game much better without the fatigue. I could really see us with a Line up of Davis/JA98 on run downs and Abe/MJ or English on pass downs.

They all will stay fresh and be more effective.... I think that is the goal.

So you are saying that far & away, our biggest need on this team is a rush DE who will play primarily in 3rd & long situations?

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When was MJ a dominant force in a game? Ok, outside of the Gardner Webb game, when did he dominate? Yes he dropped into coverage a decent amount, which shows his ability there, but I don't buy that he wasn't able to get into a rhythm rushing. It looked like a lack of consistent effort to me. But that's JMO.

IF MJ is going to have a chance to be an every down player, it's going to be as a 3-4 rush OLB, but even that is iffy.

I really don't have a problem with MJ in round 2 at our pick, its using our 1st rounder on him. We need just don't have the luxury of drafting a 1 down DE in the 1st round. I agree that we need a pass rushing DE, but we have other problems that need to be fixed as well in the draft, and those are problems that are not just 3rd down problems, but 1st, 2nd & 3rd down problems. That's my biggest issue with us considering him. There are teams that could afford to do it, but they are teams with solid starters & depth at most positions & have a need for a pass rusher. We are not one of those teams.

I guess i am not seeing what you are seeing regarding the draft. Who at 24 that stands to be availabe( I know that we can predict the draft, but we have reasonable expectations) would come in and help us on those downs.

OLB - I dont think will start

DT- unless Lewis will not be able to go, dont think will start. May play on Running downs though

S - I would rather go with Decoud and Coleman than to put a rookie out there, especially since there is not a superstar Safety at our pick

CB - Maybe but he will still be a rookie, I like Jackson above any rookie out there.

OT - This is the only position that can come in and start at RT and push Clabo inside to G.

TE- unless it is B. Pettigrew, but he may not be the answer that we are looking for in a TE, especially since trying to acquire LJ

It really all depends on who falls, but we still are at 24 and the Patriots have similiar needs too.

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So you are saying that far & away, our biggest need on this team is a rush DE who will play primarily in 3rd & long situations?

I am saying that based on where we pick. We really need a DT 1st and foremost but i dont think that Raji will be available to us.

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