So it looks like the Panthers are for real

[joe horn]

And everyone else in the NFC South has ISSUES.

I hate this division.

[jatchisv2]

Issues?

You call that debacle today having ISSUES???

The Saints played like ISH on both sides of the ball today.

[knight rider]

We better bounce back next week.

[joe horn]

Issues?

You call that debacle today having ISSUES???

The Saints played like ISH on both sides of the ball today.

Sucking is a pretty big issue, it would seem.

Well, all I saw of the game was a series of frustrating cell phone updates. I think it's fair to say we have injury issues, among other things. JC had 320+ yards?! Lemme guess, McKenzie wasn't in the game, right?

[Dr. Do Itch Big]

Sucking is a pretty big issue, it would seem.

Well, all I saw of the game was a series of frustrating cell phone updates. I think it's fair to say we have injury issues, among other things. JC had 320+ yards?! Lemme guess, McKenzie wasn't in the game, right?

give jc some credit he played alot better than last week.

[jungleking]

I could've told you that a looong time ago, man.

[bossFALCON™]

our division still sucks IMO. TB still has a questionable offense, good D though; NO has a questionable defense, good O though; falcons can stay in games, yet they FAIL in the redzone and are rebuilding; CAR has won both of their games, but both by 3 points or less and against pretty good Ds, and without steve smith. they are impressing me this year, but how many times can they pull one out of their ***?.

i dont think any team in our division will see the NFCCG at this point, but we have 14 more games to go and opinions change.

[IonSen88]

Carolina had two nail biters on the road and at home to a mediocre Bears team led by the vaunted Kyle Orton. When Steve Smith returns and Delhomme gets that jump-ball fever, the Panthers will return to their mediocrity.

[irishbuc]

Carolina had two nail biters on the road and at home to a mediocre Bears team led by the vaunted Kyle Orton. When Steve Smith returns and Delhomme gets that jump-ball fever, the Panthers will return to their mediocrity.

I don't know. The Bears D seems like it's back. I'm still impressed they managed to beat both of those teams, they should be taken seriously.

[Michael K]

Carolina had two nail biters on the road and at home to a mediocre Bears team led by the vaunted Kyle Orton. When Steve Smith returns and Delhomme gets that jump-ball fever, the Panthers will return to their mediocrity.

I don't follow. The line around here following the announcement of Smith's suspension was how screwed we were without him-teams are just going to stack the box, shut down the run, and force Delhomme into making the boneheaded mistakes he's somewhat infamous for. Contrarily, we were able to run the ball and Delhomme, while decidedly unspectacular, took care of the ball and managed to pull off some clutch plays. So now, with Smith coming back, we're going to see the 2006 Delhomme forcing balls into triple coverage because Steve Smith was his only read in Henning's archaic offensive system? What makes you think that he's going to suddenly forget how to check down, especially with his performance during the 2007 season with Davidson at OC?

If anything, you'd think Smith being on the field would insulate Delhomme from mistakes because it'll get the strong safety out of the box and open up the run even more.

[IonSen88]

I don't follow. The line around here following the announcement of Smith's suspension was how screwed we were without him-teams are just going to stack the box, shut down the run, and force Delhomme into making the boneheaded mistakes he's somewhat infamous for. Contrarily, we were able to run the ball and Delhomme, while decidedly unspectacular, took care of the ball and managed to pull off some clutch plays. So now, with Smith coming back, we're going to see the 2006 Delhomme forcing balls into triple coverage because Steve Smith was his only read in Henning's archaic offensive system? What makes you think that he's going to suddenly forget how to check down, especially with his performance during the 2007 season with Davidson at OC?

If anything, you'd think Smith being on the field would insulate Delhomme from mistakes because it'll get the strong safety out of the box and open up the run even more.

That line certainly didn't come from me.

Even with Smith out-wide, not many teams respect your running game. He's been your go-to wide-receiver since 2005 and Carolina has failed to produce a consistent running game ever since [safety out-of-the-box or not]. Carolina was not able to run the ball and Jake did not have to fed Stevonne's ego. So far Carolina has been taking advantage of good field position and turnovers from their defense. That's the difference. That's why they are 2-0. Jake the Snake has not been mistake-free and has not been on fire with his pedestrian 73.0 quarterback rating.

[irishbuc]

That line certainly didn't come from me.

Even with Smith out-wide, not many teams respect your running game. He's been your go-to wide-receiver since 2005 and Carolina has failed to produce a consistent running game ever since [safety out-of-the-box or not]. Carolina was not able to run the ball and Jake did not have to fed Stevonne's ego. So far Carolina has been taking advantage of good field position and turnovers from their defense. That's the difference. That's why they are 2-0. Jake the Snake has not been mistake-free and has not been on fire with his pedestrian 73.0 quarterback rating.

You'd make any excuse as to why another team in the south can't possibly live up to their billing. The Panthers are playing good ball right now. We can only assume with Smith back they'll play even better. If they can beat the chargers and bears without Smith, I don't want to know what they can do WITH him.

[IonSen88]

I don't want to know what they can do WITH him.

What they've been doing the past couple of years. Revert back to mediocrity.

Delhomme gets jump-ball fever with Steve Smith. He just begins to force balls that he just shouldn't force....Desperate to ensure Stevonne is among the NFL's leading wide receivers, Delhomme will fire into double coverage, triple coverage, even quadruple coverage (like he did against Seattle in the 2005 NFCCG). He is relentless in his efforts and it shows.

[Michael K]

That line certainly didn't come from me.

Even with Smith out-wide, not many teams respect your running game. He's been your go-to wide-receiver since 2005 and Carolina has failed to produce a consistent running game ever since [safety out-of-the-box or not]. Carolina was not able to run the ball and Jake did not have to fed Stevonne's ego. So far Carolina has been taking advantage of good field position and turnovers from their defense. That's the difference. That's why they are 2-0. Jake the Snake has not been mistake-free and has not been on fire with his pedestrian 73.0 quarterback rating.

I won't argue that Delhomme has put up huge numbers. The offense has mostly reverted to short and mid-range passes since we have no true downfield threat. Of course he hasn't been mistake free-he does have one pick, although it was basically a catch ripped out of Jeff King's hands. My point was that he isn't forcing balls anymore and he isn't handcuffed by a stubborn offensive coordinator and his pet system. The game against Chicago was sloppy as **** as far as penalties are concerned, and it had the potential to be a lot worse if Delhomme didn't show patience and poise. He also had a touchdown pass to Muhammad and a big gain to Hackett called back due to penalties. Winning has a tendency to make that kind of stuff not matter as much, though. If Jake did nothing, then you have to hand it to Fox and Davidson for coming up with a good game plan, coaching up the defense, and adjusting well. We were down 17-3 at one point after all.

I've never understood the logic of "well, the only reason you're putting up points is because your defense and special teams are playing well" and how that's supposed to be bad. I can see it being disadvantageous if you've got a massively hot-cold quarterback like Rex Grossman under center, but we don't have that particular issue. Tampa Bay and Baltimore won Super Bowls that way, so if that's what helps us win then so be it. Chris Harris has to be our biggest defensive FA pickup in ages. He comes to play every week. You have a point though, I guess we won't know if our offense is any good until we engineer a long, game-winning drive in the waning minutes of the fourth quarter on the road or something like that. You'll get to see how mediocre we are in two weeks at any rate.

[IonSen88]

My point was that he isn't forcing balls anymore and he isn't handcuffed by a stubborn offensive coordinator and his pet system.

What do you call that pump-fake attempt to Daunte Rosario in double coverage against San Diego? Was it complete? Yes, but it was certainly forced. It was literally a hair from being tipped by not one but two defenders.

If Jake did nothing, then you have to hand it to Fox and Davidson for coming up with a good game plan, coaching up the defense, and adjusting well. We were down 17-3 at one point after all.

I think John Fox is a better coach than some realize and is not worthy of being on the hot seat.

I've never understood the logic of "well, the only reason you're putting up points is because your defense and special teams are playing well" and how that's supposed to be bad. I can see it being disadvantageous if you've got a massively hot-cold quarterback like Rex Grossman under center, but we don't have that particular issue. Tampa Bay and Baltimore won Super Bowls that way, so if that's what helps us win then so be it. Chris Harris has to be our biggest defensive FA pickup in ages. He comes to play every week. You have a point though, I guess we won't know if our offense is any good until we engineer a long, game-winning drive in the waning minutes of the fourth quarter on the road or something like that. You'll get to see how mediocre we are in two weeks at any rate.

No one said it was bad. But you cannot continue to expect fumbles returned for touchdowns or turnovers in general. They do not come that consistently. They fluctuate, and when they do, you have to go back to the basics and fundamentals. Carolina hasn't produced a consistent running game or passing game.

PS: Bring it on. We're not afraid of baby blue cats or your kitten-like roar. We've went into Bank of America stadium and defeated Carolina before and shall have no problems doing it again.

[jungleking]

What do you call that pump-fake attempt to Daunte Rosario in double coverage against San Diego? Was it complete? Yes, but it was certainly forced. It was literally a hair from being tipped by not one but two defenders.

I think John Fox is a better coach than some realize and is not worthy of being on the hot seat.

No one said it was bad. But you cannot continue to expect fumbles returned for touchdowns or turnovers in general. They do not come that consistently. They fluctuate, and when they do, you have to go back to the basics and fundamentals. Carolina hasn't produced a consistent running game or passing game.

PS: Bring it on. We're not afraid of baby blue cats or your kitten-like roar. We've went into Bank of America stadium and defeated Carolina before and shall have no problems doing it again.

Running well on two of the best defenses in the league (SD and Chicago) who all have at least nine men in the box, the second time without a starting right guard who should be returning soon, that ought to be more than enough evidence to make people start respecting our running game.

And yes, the pass was forced. But when there are eight defenders in the endzone, EVERY pass is going to be forced. Jake had the presence of mind to pump fake away from his tallest receiver and then put it right into his hands with some zip on it. That's not what I call a jump ball.

[pantherfan4ever]

What do you call that pump-fake attempt to Daunte Rosario in double coverage against San Diego? Was it complete? Yes, but it was certainly forced. It was literally a hair from being tipped by not one but two defenders.

Ummm...didn't this come on a 4th down play with zero time left on the clock and Carolina down by 5??? Are you seriously criticizing Delhomme throwing the ball into a tight spot in that scenario where the defense had, like, 6 DBs in the game???? Seriously?????

I guess he should have held onto the ball for about 5 more seconds and waited for another receiver to become open...

[jungleking]

I88 has a point. A lot of breaks have been going the Panthers way on the turnovers but, those breaks tend to even themselves out then you have to play down for down. I am not saying the Panthers shouldn't be happy because a 2-0 start is nice but, you can't count on things of that nature to keep continually happening. I am anxious to see how we stack up against one another in a few weeks.

I'm pretty sure that Chris Harris led the league in forced fumbles last year. It's not surprising that he's had two in the last few weeks.

It seems that everyone's forgetting the fact that we had the punt block returned for a touchdown at the end of our very first possession. I wouldn't say that ALL the breaks have been going our way. Anyway, we had a completely ridiculous amount of penalties last week, which more than evened out the game.

Also, Steve Smith coming back adds a completely new dimension to our game. I don't think we're going to have to rely strictly on turnovers for much longer.

[IonSen88]

Running well on two of the best defenses in the league (SD and Chicago) who all have at least nine men in the box, the second time without a starting right guard who should be returning soon, that ought to be more than enough evidence to make people start respecting our running game.

And yes, the pass was forced. But when there are eight defenders in the endzone, EVERY pass is going to be forced. Jake had the presence of mind to pump fake away from his tallest receiver and then put it right into his hands with some zip on it. That's not what I call a jump ball.

Chicago doesn't have a great run defense and Carolina did not run well against them. San Diego's defense is a has-been as well; getting raped by Jay Cutler and a Selvin Young.

I didn't call that a jump-ball. The guy said Delhomme hasn't forced the ball and I gave an instance in his first game. You'll see the jump-ball when Delhomme spots #89. Otherwise, who the heck would he throw a jump-ball to? D.J Hackett?!

[IonSen88]

Ummm...didn't this come on a 4th down play with zero time left on the clock and Carolina down by 5??? Are you seriously criticizing Delhomme throwing the ball into a tight spot in that scenario where the defense had, like, 6 DBs in the game???? Seriously?????

I guess he should have held onto the ball for about 5 more seconds and waited for another receiver to become open...

I'm not criticizing Jake at all. I'm just not naive enough to say he hasn't forced a ball yet this season. SD had 6 DBs, Carolina had 5 WRs. 2 defensive backs were on 1 receiver after that pump-fake anyway...

Either that or he should have pump faked it again so another defender could defend Rosario.

[jpepp4prez]

We are for real...quit hating!

[jpepp4prez]

Nobody is hating! Two weeks does not make a season and as past/former/present paper champions the Panthers/fans should know that better than anyone!

I know, but it has been a happy two weeks ...

[ThunderCookie]

We are for real...quit hating!

I haven't seen either game, but back to back come fourth quarter wins against quality opponents?

I don't know how much more real you can get.

[Michael K]

I'm not criticizing Jake at all. I'm just not naive enough to say he hasn't forced a ball yet this season. SD had 6 DBs, Carolina had 5 WRs. 2 defensive backs were on 1 receiver after that pump-fake anyway...

Either that or he should have pump faked it again so another defender could defend Rosario.

You can't show me a two minute drill where some balls aren't forced unless the defense is having total breakdowns in coverage. I wasn't insisting that he didn't force passes at all anymore, it's just that in general, he's making smarter decisions with the ball. This could be due to a better offensive system, divine intervention, epiphany, whatever.

To me, forcing a fumble or getting a clutch pick has the same value as getting a solid stop because it gets the opposing offense off the field. That said, the ability of the defense to force fumbles has helped but it hasn't been our saving grace. They made several tough stops in the closing minutes against Chicago, including the game winner where they had three shots to gain a single yard but couldn't.

I wish I would have recorded it now, it was a total slugfest. The NFL.com highlight package can't really showcase that very well.

[ThunderCookie]

There is a sensible reply. I respect that!...yes, who wouldn't be happy with a 2-0 start?

Someone who has played three games?

They would be all like, "Where the **** did game three go? Somebody gimme back my game three!"

That was a lot funnier in my head.

Wait...

No it wasn't.