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Parents allow child to die waiting for prayer to be answered.


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I hope these two go to jail for a little while.

http://wkbt.com/Global/story.asp?S=8072369&nav=menu239_2

WESTON, Wis. (AP) - The mother of an 11-year-old rural Weston girl who died of untreated diabetes says she didn't know her daughter was terminally ill as she prayed for her to get better instead of taking her to the doctor.

Madeline Neumann died Sunday from an undiagnosed and treatable form of diabetes.

Her mother, Leilani Neumann, tells The Associated Press her daughter's condition worsened suddenly, and the parents stayed in prayer, believing she would recover.

She also says she's not concerned about a police investigation, because she and her husband believe their lives are in God's hands and they did nothing criminal, only tried to do the best they could for their daughter.

Everest Metro Police Chief Dan Vergin says an autopsy showed the girl died from a type of diabetes that left her with too little insulin in her body. He says she had probably been ill for about 30 days.

But Leilani Neumann says her daughter was in good health until recently. The girl attended public school last fall but has been home-schooled this semester.

The chief says he expects the investigation to wrap up by Friday and the findings to be forwarded to the district attorney to review for possible charges.

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savwboy savwboy (3/27/2008)
The insanity of prayer?? What do you mean by that exactly?

More like the insanity of the parents..Why turn this into a an anti-religion thread..

That's what I was wondering, the Bible never teaches against taking your kids to the doctor.  I admire the parent's faith but with faith you also are supposed to use common sense and they did not.

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braves_n_falcons (3/27/2008)
I hope these two go to jail for a little while.

http://wkbt.com/Global/story.asp?S=8072369&nav=menu239_2

WESTON, Wis. (AP) - The mother of an 11-year-old rural Weston girl who died of untreated diabetes says she didn't know her daughter was terminally ill as she prayed for her to get better instead of taking her to the doctor.

Madeline Neumann died Sunday from an undiagnosed and treatable form of diabetes.

Her mother, Leilani Neumann, tells The Associated Press her daughter's condition worsened suddenly, and the parents stayed in prayer, believing she would recover.

She also says she's not concerned about a police investigation, because she and her husband believe their lives are in God's hands and they did nothing criminal, only tried to do the best they could for their daughter.

Everest Metro Police Chief Dan Vergin says an autopsy showed the girl died from a type of diabetes that left her with too little insulin in her body. He says she had probably been ill for about 30 days.

But Leilani Neumann says her daughter was in good health until recently. The girl attended public school last fall but has been home-schooled this semester.

The chief says he expects the investigation to wrap up by Friday and the findings to be forwarded to the district attorney to review for possible charges.

sad :(  I have known people who could have been those parents :( extremism is found in all religions :(  I think it's ok to believe in a god if you want to, but please believe he gave you the common sense to take your kids to a doctor when they get sick. :(  Too often when common sense is thrown out the window the results are sad :(

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Anansi (3/27/2008)
savwboy savwboy (3/27/2008)
The insanity of prayer?? What do you mean by that exactly?

More like the insanity of the parents..Why turn this into a an anti-religion thread..

That's what I was wondering, the Bible never teaches against taking your kids to the doctor. I admire the parent's faith but with faith you also are supposed to use common sense and they did not.

Thats right, faith is invaluable to our souls, it should be admired...until you come against some real world problem, then its not going to help much.

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TerminusTiercel (3/27/2008)
They were probably home schooling her because the schools were teaching her about blasphemous science.

how do you come to this conclusion? I know plenty of people who home schooled and they turned out a lot better than a bunch of friends who went to public school. Also they were taught science.

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SacFalcFan (3/27/2008)
TerminusTiercel (3/27/2008)
They were probably home schooling her because the schools were teaching her about blasphemous science.

how do you come to this conclusion? I know plenty of people who home schooled and they turned out a lot better than a bunch of friends who went to public school. Also they were taught science.

I come to this conclusion because someone who is so fundamental that they choose prayer over medicine, likely would also believe creationism over evolution, therefore having disagreements with public science classes.

However, I was pretty much joking, the other statement I made in this thread I am more serious about.

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TerminusTiercel (3/27/2008)
SacFalcFan (3/27/2008)
TerminusTiercel (3/27/2008)
They were probably home schooling her because the schools were teaching her about blasphemous science.

how do you come to this conclusion? I know plenty of people who home schooled and they turned out a lot better than a bunch of friends who went to public school. Also they were taught science.

I come to this conclusion because someone who is so fundamental that they choose prayer over medicine, likely would also believe creationism over evolution, therefore having disagreements with public science classes.

However, I was pretty much joking, the other statement I made in this thread I am more serious about.

i agree that it's crazy to choose prayer over medication. To the life of me I don't get it where people don't get medical treatment. Then when someone dies I have heard from those that the reason the person died was because they didn't have enough faith. That's pathetic.

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I love how lots of the radical evangelicals will say that they dont trust science and that scientists are doing the devils works (especially with evolution), yet when they get sick they see no problem going to a doctor.

And then people think its crazy for them not to trust a doctor when their child is sick but they dont trust scientists to tell them that animals evolve.

Its a sad story though, and I guess I went off on a little tangent there. That child should have been taken away from the household a long time ago.

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lax32 (3/27/2008)
I love how lots of the radical evangelicals will say that they dont trust science and that scientists are doing the devils works (especially with evolution), yet when they get sick they see no problem going to a doctor.

And then people think its crazy for them not to trust a doctor when their child is sick but they dont trust scientists to tell them that animals evolve.

Its a sad story though, and I guess I went off on a little tangent there. That child should have been taken away from the household a long time ago.

I love how people try to take one subject and make a horrible relation to another subject thinking they are actually trying to prove a point. Evolution and getting medical attention have zero to do with each other.

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SacFalcFan (3/27/2008)
lax32 (3/27/2008)
I love how lots of the radical evangelicals will say that they dont trust science and that scientists are doing the devils works (especially with evolution), yet when they get sick they see no problem going to a doctor.

And then people think its crazy for them not to trust a doctor when their child is sick but they dont trust scientists to tell them that animals evolve.

Its a sad story though, and I guess I went off on a little tangent there. That child should have been taken away from the household a long time ago.

I love how people try to take one subject and make a horrible relation to another subject thinking they are actually trying to prove a point. Evolution and getting medical attention have zero to do with each other.

Yes they do. Why would you trust one scientist to take a guess on what your ailment is and what treatment he should give you yet not trust another scientist to tell you that animals evolve?

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lax32 (3/27/2008)
SacFalcFan (3/27/2008)
lax32 (3/27/2008)
I love how lots of the radical evangelicals will say that they dont trust science and that scientists are doing the devils works (especially with evolution), yet when they get sick they see no problem going to a doctor.

And then people think its crazy for them not to trust a doctor when their child is sick but they dont trust scientists to tell them that animals evolve.

Its a sad story though, and I guess I went off on a little tangent there. That child should have been taken away from the household a long time ago.

I love how people try to take one subject and make a horrible relation to another subject thinking they are actually trying to prove a point. Evolution and getting medical attention have zero to do with each other.

Yes they do. Why would you trust one scientist to take a guess on what your ailment is and what treatment he should give you yet not trust another scientist to tell you that animals evolve?

I still don't see the relation to the two subjects since there are plenty of people who believe in medical care, but don't believe in evolution. There are radicals who don't believe in jack (evolution or medical care) and there are also those who handle snakes. There are all types.

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SacFalcFan (3/27/2008)
TerminusTiercel (3/27/2008)
SacFalcFan (3/27/2008)
TerminusTiercel (3/27/2008)
They were probably home schooling her because the schools were teaching her about blasphemous science.

how do you come to this conclusion? I know plenty of people who home schooled and they turned out a lot better than a bunch of friends who went to public school. Also they were taught science.

I come to this conclusion because someone who is so fundamental that they choose prayer over medicine, likely would also believe creationism over evolution, therefore having disagreements with public science classes.

However, I was pretty much joking, the other statement I made in this thread I am more serious about.

i agree that it's crazy to choose prayer over medication. To the life of me I don't get it where people don't get medical treatment. Then when someone dies I have heard from those that the reason the person died was because they didn't have enough faith. That's pathetic.

You're right. Medicine has nothing to do with biology.

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SacFalcFan (3/27/2008)
lax32 (3/27/2008)
SacFalcFan (3/27/2008)
lax32 (3/27/2008)
I love how lots of the radical evangelicals will say that they dont trust science and that scientists are doing the devils works (especially with evolution), yet when they get sick they see no problem going to a doctor.

And then people think its crazy for them not to trust a doctor when their child is sick but they dont trust scientists to tell them that animals evolve.

Its a sad story though, and I guess I went off on a little tangent there. That child should have been taken away from the household a long time ago.

I love how people try to take one subject and make a horrible relation to another subject thinking they are actually trying to prove a point. Evolution and getting medical attention have zero to do with each other.

Yes they do. Why would you trust one scientist to take a guess on what your ailment is and what treatment he should give you yet not trust another scientist to tell you that animals evolve?

I still don't see the relation to the two subjects since there are plenty of people who believe in medical care, but don't believe in evolution. There are radicals who don't believe in jack (evolution or medical care) and there are also those who handle snakes. There are all types.

Because using scientific methods, scientists have nearly unanimously come to the conclusion that animals evolve. Showing no bias, evolution is as concrete as any scientific theory that we base modern beliefs on.

So why would you say that scientific methods are flawed when it comes to creation yet trust scientists to use those exact same methods to create a diagnosis and cure for your ailment?

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Wow i hope they go to jail for stupidity. Seriously religion is bollocks. It is made up BS, i mean common do we really believe in someone who is unseen and can listen and watch over all 6 billion people on this planet?? Religion is holding this world back.

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This must be the athiest thread, lol.

Anyway, science doesn't explain everything... it just attempts to.

Another thing, how does anyone really know the parents who were praying had any faith?

U need faith for prayers to work, otherwise "non believers" would get prayers answered and they don't deserve their prayers answered.

Anyone ever notice how rich and fulfilled some peoples lives are, particularly Christians?

Anyone ever met a person with everything and still miserable?

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saint vitus (3/27/2008)
This must be the athiest thread, lol.

Anyway, science doesn't explain everything... it just attempts to.

Another thing, how does anyone really know the parents who were praying had any faith?

U need faith for prayers to work, otherwise "non believers" would get prayers answered and they don't deserve their prayers answered.

Anyone ever notice how rich and fulfilled some peoples lives are, particularly Christians?

Anyone ever met a person with everything and still miserable?

 

That statement right there is an example of why some of the "more religious?" people can get under my skin in a split second.

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Funny that all of the "religion caused this" arguments miss a cogent point:  the particular brand of religion involved here is called "enthusiasm," and has long been considered heresy in the Christian Church (which is relevant, since it is usually practiced by people who call themselves "Christian").

Basically, it is the idea that you sit around and wait for God to act on you immediately, rather than the correct view that God works through means.  But God always works through means.  He baptizes through the hands of the Pastor.  He gives daily bread through the hand of the grocer.  Etc.  So, for example, when I pray for healing, it is usually like this:  "Lord God, heavenly Father, I pray that you would keep me this day, give my physicians skill and wisdom, and if it be your will, grant me a return to health."

It is never "Lord God, please smite the evil science-doers and just make my sneezing stop."

Anything misused is bad.  This is a poor judgment and bad theology issue, not a religion issue.  Period.

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Another thing, how does anyone really know the parents who were praying had any faith?

U need faith for prayers to work, otherwise "non believers" would get prayers answered and they don't deserve their prayers answered.

So you are saying that if their faith was stronger that their little girl's diabetes would just magically go away?

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