Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

gazoo

DeAngelo Hall has been part of the problem, not part of solution

201 posts in this topic

I believe Petrino was asking for Hall to do punt/kick returns. I believe Hall said no. Strangely enough, Hall was doing PR for us at the end of the year after Quitrino left. :w00t:

Sounds to me like Hall just wanted a coach he could respect, and Petrino is obviously not a person you can respect.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LADBABY (2/25/2008)
Pencil I am just saying Hall shouldn't say no

to the coach because he is afraid he will get

the wood laid to him. He doesn't get to decline

like it was an offer. He is supposed to be a

football player. The coach tells him what his

job is and not vice versa.

I didn't say he was afraid, I said it would be bad if it happened. And if a coach has no business coaching in the NFL, it comes through. And it did.

I'm all for players following instructions from their leader, but it is clear Petrino was not a leader in any sense. If we saw the outwardly quitter, imagine what the players saw behind the scenes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pencilpusher (2/25/2008)
LADBABY (2/25/2008)
Pencil I am just saying Hall shouldn't say no

to the coach because he is afraid he will get

the wood laid to him. He doesn't get to decline

like it was an offer. He is supposed to be a

football player. The coach tells him what his

job is and not vice versa.

I didn't say he was afraid, I said it would be bad if it happened. And if a coach has no business coaching in the NFL, it comes through. And it did.

I'm all for players following instructions from their leader, but it is clear Petrino was not a leader in any sense. If we saw the outwardly quitter, imagine what the players saw behind the scenes.

I said that he was afraid or something because Deon Sanders

would have gone down for a few flies but not this guy. If you

like him you should be happy I think we are keeping him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rev AL Sharpton because Gazoo was campaigning for him and Moss to join the Falcons....but wants to rid us of D-Hall, who is their defensive equivilant.

Why would you say something that is so patently false? I never wanted Moss or TO here. I said the Falcons locker room wasn;t strong enough to deal with them .

Now, when we get a good solid group of veteran leadership for our locker room, then you can add pieces like a Moss. I can;t stand TO, and my brother lives in Philly, is a huge Philly fan ( I went to the Falcons game up there 2 seasons ago and froze my azz off) and said TO was a horrible signing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
vickandbailey And not trying to be personal on this MB but what is up with this autobot, deceptacon thing between Gaz and Pencil. :

I don't even pay the kid any attention to be honest with you. I see his name and almost always skip right down to the next post.

I'm here to discuss football with the civil, sincere, rational Falcon fans. I largy ignore the parasites and character assassins.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
birdweiserrr (2/24/2008)
What the ****??? I agree with Gazoo?

Good post. Hopefully there's no spin behind it.

This isn't his first great post! He's made too many for me to count......:D;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's the Deal Gazoo...

Me and You, we wear the same uniform in this fight. Everyone on this board, knows who we both "openly" campaign for. I just respectfully disagree with the happiness of getting rid of a player of D-Hall's caliber. They aren't drafted every year. If we don't have a "strong enough" lockeroom...what da **** is Milloy and Brook' still doing here?

I just don't understand how he's good enough for "winners" but his "selfishness" is not wanted in Atlanta. HMMM, how about Chad J in Cincy? You've been hearing about him, wanting out all season...but you know what Marv Lewis said? **** NO! You just don't give up on talent like that.....Now, can you honestly say D-Hall is more selfish than Chad? Is Cincy any better than Atlanta, right now?

When has rebuilding ever worked for us?:cool:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rev AL Sharpton (2/24/2008)
Sorry Gazoo....you and I are usually on the same side of the argument, but I have to respectfully disagree...

You say he was a cancer, could you provide a link from anyone credible. And why would the new HC want to keep him...if that is so.

Why are "winning franchises (the ones that have won SB's) interested in acquiring him.

Also, isn't this the same argument for bringing Moss and TO here, but the reason you want to get rid of a D-Hall?

And for the last time, we are not Patriots. The Giants didn't win this year, trying to be like the Patriots.

As far as rebuilding, this team has been rebuilding since it arrived in Atl. Rebulding is a excuse given to the fanbase...to ignore the current results and expect better next year.

You are doing the exact thing that you accuse other posters of doing. When players are on their way out, they "weren't" worth the trouble anyway. As far as 2006 goes, I seriously doubt D-Hall was begging for the 10+ yard cushion that he was giving WRs.

Great post, Rev.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Although i dont believe he is part of the problem i would like to see what kind of deals we can get out of him. I started 100% opposed to trading him when the word of him supposedly getting traded started but i am starting to become optimistic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LADBABY (2/25/2008)
While I love to see so much unity on a subject

from so wide a range of posters I think Coach

Smith likes Deangelo Hall and "hopes he is a Falcon

for many years to come." So in spite of Hall's

media blitz to get traded he is only part of the

puzzle. Our coach is trying to build a team and

we may not get full value for Hall now that he

has shown his ##### again. If we can't get a good

trade he is staying and he has hindered our

plans with this showboating about being gone

and not being the New England type fit.

Do you remember when Petrino asked him to

take some plays on offense? He declined. I

remember saying "what is going on?" That told

me something about Petrino and Hall. What kind

of coach would take no for an answer and what

kind of player would say "no thanks, coach."

Hall never respected Petrino in any way shape or form he has said this a couple of times. Not as a coach. Not as a fellow member of the NFL. Not even as a person. Sounds pretty harsh to me. But in the end it looks like he was the better man because Petrino ended up quitting. Quitters never prosper. Petrino will always be remembered for ruining a team. I will be suprised if we ever see him as a coach in the NFL again. I hope he likes coaching college ball.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rev AL Sharpton (2/26/2008)
Here's the Deal Gazoo...

Me and You, we wear the same uniform in this fight. Everyone on this board, knows who we both "openly" campaign for. I just respectfully disagree with the happiness of getting rid of a player of D-Hall's caliber. They aren't drafted every year. If we don't have a "strong enough" lockeroom...what da **** is Milloy and Brook' still doing here?

I just don't understand how he's good enough for "winners" but his "selfishness" is not wanted in Atlanta. HMMM, how about Chad J in Cincy? You've been hearing about him, wanting out all season...but you know what Marv Lewis said? **** NO! You just don't give up on talent like that.....Now, can you honestly say D-Hall is more selfish than Chad? Is Cincy any better than Atlanta, right now?

When has rebuilding ever worked for us?:cool:

Another great post and I'm glad to see that you're not sipping the kool-aide like most of these homers responding to this thread.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am a huge D-Hall fan and really wish there was someway we could keep him....I agree with you that the timing is reason we have to part ways. If we were a playoff caliber team, I really don't think he would be any burden at all. He clearly is one of the most competitive players in the league, that is why he comes unglued at times. He obviously hates to loose, and I can only imagine how playing for Atlanta this past season impacted his attitude. I think he is worth the contract, and his attitude has at times just been an expression of frustration from a 24 year old superstar athlete that knows his team should have been better. Don't forget about Petrino in all this either. Hall was asked to set aside differnces and play ball for a man with no morals at all when it comes to "team". As a fan....I truly hate what is happening to our team, make the bleeding stop!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rev AL Sharpton (2/25/2008)
PP,

Being from Philly, I can tell you...there is still an aftertaste of the TO departure. They are still trying to find a WR to match his output. Not to mention, there is now a strong push to get McNabb outta town. So after all that...TO ends up being right. He didn't need Philly to be the man, Philly needed him. There was unfair treatment all around him. And I brought him up in this thread earlier, because Gazoo was campaigning for him and Moss to join the Falcons....but wants to rid us of D-Hall, who is their defensive equivilant.

Disagree Rev

Just because the Eagles haven't signed a WR of TO's ability since then it doens't make him right for what he did. They tried to go out and get Javon Walker from GB, but the Packers didn't want him in the NFC and they got out-bid by the Broncos - it happens. They did trade for Stallworth, but there is apparently something up with him that scares teams - they are hesitant to committ to him long term.

There were very few takers for TO after that whole deal. If Jones wasn't the owner in Dallas he may not have got another shot - at least not at that level of pay. He wasn't right.

And there are still way more Philly fans that want to keep McNabb around than want him gone. And many that are entertaining the idea of a trade are only doing so because he could bring exceptional long-term value in return.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
gazoo (2/25/2008)
I don't even pay the kid any attention to be honest with you. I see his name and almost always skip right down to the next post.

I'm here to discuss football with the civil, sincere, rational Falcon fans. I largy ignore the parasites and character assassins.

Actually, I thought his post on this thread was pretty well laid out and brought a great counterarguement to your post. I don't fully agree with your original post, and PP put things in a good perspective.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The fact is, we don't know what conversations took place out of the media. Yes, Petrino was a royal screw-up and sent team morale spiraling out of control. However, you've got to be a team player even in that situation. There are positive and negative ways to voice your opinion. Unfortunately, even when your boss is a jerk you still have to be a team player or or risk damaging your future with the organization.

I readily acknowledge that everything Hall said about Petrino was right, but that doesn't mean that he didn't royally T-off Blank by being a negative force on the team when they were struggling the most. CEO's remember that kind of stuff.

"Better to remain quiet and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to disagree whole heartedly!

Deangelo has his faults, like we all do. BUt his faults are he wants to be the best and he is ultra competitive. He spouts off, and seems self centered, but it is his competitive nature, not just being self. Sure there are times when he could knock down a hail mary instead of trying to intercept, but in his world stats do matter. they matter for pro-bowl votes as well as peer review, as who is the baddest and best DB. Lets say he grabs that ball, and runs it up field for a td, is that self centered? Of course not. Was Ellis Hobbs 109 td return self centered? No because it worked. You could see Belichick grimmacing when he caught the ball way back in the end zone. and Hobbs should have taken a knee.

A lot of people may or may not be competitive on these boards, and may ot be able to recognize that someone who is a ferricious competitor has faults, but it is Hall's drive to be the best, and make his team better that is his only fault. he is not a cancer. He is what all of our team should be. Ferrocious competitors, who lay it all out to be the best at their position, not just good teammates.

Gimme 53 Deangelo's you can keep the yessmen!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
gazoo (2/25/2008)
vickandbailey And not trying to be personal on this MB but what is up with this autobot, deceptacon thing between Gaz and Pencil. :

I don't even pay the kid any attention to be honest with you. I see his name and almost always skip right down to the next post.

I'm here to discuss football with the civil, sincere, rational Falcon fans. I largy ignore the parasites and character assassins.

Its all good Gazoo. As Falcon fans, there is no way we will agree on every issue.

But I agree with you that its nice to discuss things civilly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
the evil emperor

Its all good Gazoo. As Falcon fans, there is no way we will agree on every issue.

But I agree with you that its nice to discuss things civilly.

No prob my friend...if everyone agreed we'd all be bored out of our minds. I started this for debate, all respectfl sides are welcome.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I have really mixed feelings on this one.

My biggest concern about the trade, is that IMO CB is one of the 4 premier positon on a football team (QB, OT, DE, CB). Those are the position that are most difficult to fill, and where you want/need to use your best draft picks, spend the most money and have your best players. Giving away of Hall's age and talent for just a 2nd and 6th strikes me as really poor value - particualrly when you consoder that we gave up the 23rd pick in the draft for Peerless Price, and the #29 pick for an ageing and injury prone John Abraham. Hall is younger, healthier and considerably better than both.

On the flip side of the coin, the Raiders will have to pay Hall $9m+ a season.  If I were a raider fan I wouldn't be happy giving up high 2nd round pick and 6th rounder plus $9m a season for 1 player. They could probably fill 4 or 5 holes with the pick(s) and money, if they use them wisely. (I was against our Price and Abe trades on the same basis).

I've never been a big fan of Hall's attitude. Coach Mora said that he wanted "Athletic Arrogance", and that's exactly what he got with Hall. He has always been come accross as as a player who is more cocnerned about himself and his personal accomplishments than being a member of a succesful team. The unsportsmanlike conduct penalties, grabbing of the face mask, cheapshots, trianing camp fights and soap-boxing in the media have never sat well with me.  The way that he exploded at Petrino last year was totally unaccetable. No player should disrespect his head coach that way (even if the Coach subsequently turned out to be a cowardly traitor). Any player can lose his cool or comit a stupid penalty once in a while, but with Hall these outbursts were too common for my liking.

On a positive side, we aren't trading Hall to a conference opponent, where he could come back and hurt us down the line. We only play the raiders every 4 years, and a Falcons Raiders superbowl is unlikely. 

Maybe the biggest potential positive about this trade is the cap space that we will save over the next 6 years by not re-signing him (as we will probably need to use a 2nd round pick to find a competent replacement). How we use that cap space and the pick we get will really determine how good - or bad - a trade it is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ukfalc (3/16/2008)
I have really mixed feelings on this one.

My biggest concern about the trade, is that IMO CB is one of the 4 premier positon on a football team (QB, OT, DE, CB). Those are the position that are most difficult to fill, and where you want/need to use your best draft picks, spend the most money and have your best players.

I disagree, and here is why:

The NYGs won the Super Bowl with an outstanding DL on defense that caused Tom Brady fits before he could get the ball out. NYGs had no premier cover corner against the best passing offense in the NFL that broke rcords for TD passes and still won. The NYG CBs were plenty good enough becuase of the DL. They beat Tom Brady and that stud packed offense by beating them in the trenches, not by out covering their WR's.

 The financial resources are better spent on the DL than on the CBs.

  Houston is a good young CB tha we got in the 2nd round last year, and we have 3 picks in tha same area this year. We get another good young CB lke Houston this year again and we will be fine, AS LONG AS WE CONTINUE BUIOLDING THE DL.

You know who will make Houston a better CB? Dorsey.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites