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Barack Obama vs. John McCain


deathdawg
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deathdawg (2/16/2008)
Can we get affordable healthcare? No, you can't.

Can I get married if I'm born gay? No, you can't.

Can I come home from Iraq? No, you can't.

Can I pay my mortgage? No, you can't.

Can I get that $50 per hr job picking lettuce? No, you can't.

I pay $25 dollars a month for healthcare through my job with no co-pay. Yes, I'm GETTING affordable healthcare and it would probably be even better if the government would butt out.

I don't think people are "born" gay and no they can't get married but I have no problems with a civil union with similiar benefits.

Nobody forced anyone to join the military and that's something that comes along with the commitment, that said, I do think we need to get out.

I pay my mortgage just fine with no help from the government. I could actually pay it even more if they'd butt out and let me control my own money.

Anyone paying $50 to pick lettuce is a fool and anyone promising it is a bigger fool.

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I'm pretty sure the "lettuce picking job" is referring to this:

McCain's straight-talking image called into question

By Ron Fournier, AP Political Writer | April 5, 2006

WASHINGTON --Has the "Straight Talk Express" veered to the right?

...

Murmurs from the crowd turned to booing. "Pay a decent wage!" one audience member shouted. McCain curtly threatened to cut the speech short, which quieted the crowd.

...

That's when one audience member unleashed the barnyard epithet.

McCain got another laugh when he finished the speech and asked whether anybody had "questions, comments or insults." One audience member obliged with a pointed question on his immigration plan.

McCain responded by saying immigrants were taking jobs nobody else wanted. He offered anybody in the crowd $50 an hour to pick lettuce in Arizona.

Shouts of protest rose from the crowd, with some accepting McCain's job offer.

"I'll take it!" one man shouted.

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The Egoist (2/16/2008)
Can I get that $50 per hr job picking lettuce? No, you can't.

This is moronic. Are you suggesting you deserve a highly set price (decided only by the workers, of course) for the labor of which can be done by a 15 year old?

Evidently you didn't hear John McCain talking about how he would pay someone $50 per hr to pick lettuce if they could do it all season... That's when he said No You Can't, lol.

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capologist (2/16/2008)
deathdawg (2/16/2008)
Can we get affordable healthcare? No, you can't.

Can I get married if I'm born gay? No, you can't.

Can I come home from Iraq? No, you can't.

Can I pay my mortgage? No, you can't.

Can I get that $50 per hr job picking lettuce? No, you can't.

I pay $25 dollars a month for healthcare through my job with no co-pay. Yes, I'm GETTING affordable healthcare and it would probably be even better if the government would butt out.

I don't think people are "born" gay and no they can't get married but I have no problems with a civil union with similiar benefits.

Nobody forced anyone to join the military and that's something that comes along with the commitment, that said, I do think we need to get out.

I pay my mortgage just fine with no help from the government. I could actually pay it even more if they'd butt out and let me control my own money.

Anyone paying $50 to pick lettuce is a fool and anyone promising it is a bigger fool.

$25 a month for no copay health care, I'm sure my premiums make up the difference so you can get access to health insurance for less than a $1 a day. I'm sure through your stained glass windows everyone paying less than a $1 a day and complaining about high health insurance costs is pretty lame huh?

To cover the four in my family my health insurance premiums are over $850 a month and still only covers 80% of total costs. Then we have 5 employees that the business pays half their premiums.

We have shopped all the major providers and these are pretty comparable rates.

Oh that bigger fool you were talking about was John McCain.

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Steve_Bartkowski (2/16/2008)
Barack Obama:

Can we have higher taxes? Yes you can

Can we have socialized medicine that will result in longer wait times and higher government spending? Yes you can

Can I come home from Iraq prematurely and cause further instability in the middle east? Yes you can

Can I have more welfare payed with American taxpayer money? Yes you can

John McCain:

Can we lower taxes for the middle class and raise it for the rich? No We Can't

Can we offer the same health insurance for congress to the rest of America? No We Can't

Can we end a war that was mission accomplished years ago? No we can't

Can we be compassionate and help the less fortunate? No we can't

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deathdawg (2/16/2008)

$25 a month for no copay health care, I'm sure my premiums make up the difference so you can get access to health insurance for less than a $1 a day. I'm sure through your stained glass windows everyone paying less than a $1 a day and complaining about high health insurance costs is pretty lame huh?

To cover the four in my family my health insurance premiums are over $850 a month and still only covers 80% of total costs. Then we have 5 employees that the business pays half their premiums.

We have shopped all the major providers and these are pretty comparable rates.

I'm single with no kids. I'm quite sure your premiums have nothing to do with my benefits. It has everything to do with the company I work for making it happen and I'm quite certain that type of alternative is open to other companies too. Not sure where and why the stained glass window comment is coming from but that's a bit extreme on your part and uncalled for as well.

Obviously you are self-employed so the situations are entirely different. I'm working towards being self-employed myself so one day I'll find out.

That said, one of the reasons I'm a Libertarian is because small-businesses get pinched way too much and social security is a huge player in that. I think privatizing health care completely would lower prices completely...

deathdawg (2/16/2008)

Oh that bigger fool you were talking about was John McCain.

I know what you were referencing and I'm quite positive it was highly out of context...

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capologist (2/16/2008)
deathdawg (2/16/2008)

$25 a month for no copay health care, I'm sure my premiums make up the difference so you can get access to health insurance for less than a $1 a day. I'm sure through your stained glass windows everyone paying less than a $1 a day and complaining about high health insurance costs is pretty lame huh?

To cover the four in my family my health insurance premiums are over $850 a month and still only covers 80% of total costs. Then we have 5 employees that the business pays half their premiums.

We have shopped all the major providers and these are pretty comparable rates.

I'm single with no kids. I'm quite sure your premiums have nothing to do with my benefits. It has everything to do with the company I work for making it happen and I'm quite certain that type of alternative is open to other companies too. Not sure where and why the stained glass window comment is coming from but that's a bit extreme on your part and uncalled for as well.

Obviously you are self-employed so the situations are entirely different. I'm working towards being self-employed myself so one day I'll find out.

That said, one of the reasons I'm a Libertarian is because small-businesses get pinched way too much and social security is a huge player in that. I think privatizing health care completely would lower prices completely...

deathdawg (2/16/2008)

Oh that bigger fool you were talking about was John McCain.

I know what you were referencing and I'm quite positive it was highly out of context...

Privatized is fine, but we are feeling the crunch of PRIVATE mortgage companies that went unregulated. Government should be there to govern or balance, but instead we turned our back and now the middle class is hurting.

What is your argument for the insurance companies that refuse coverage for diabetics and others with chronic illness? Should those people just pay for it out of pocket? I mean $1 a day should cover it right?

Should we entertain ideas to streamline the industry to reduce cost or just leave things the way there are and hope that people crawl out of poverty so they can afford to pay $850 a month + 20% of actual cost?

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deathdawg (2/16/2008)

Privatized is fine, but we are feeling the crunch of PRIVATE mortgage companies that went unregulated. Government should be there to govern or balance, but instead we turned our back and now the middle class is hurting.

There's plenty of banking regulations (I spent 6 years as a banker so I'm well-versed). There's the Truth In Lending Act for starters. If a consumer's rights under TILA has been violated they have recourse. By the way, I'm about as middle class as it gets and I'm not "hurting". I'm not where I want to be because of some horrible decisions along the way but I'm not "hurting". I think it's a bit melodramatic to characterize it as such. However, if you truly feel that way then why not phase out Socialist Security and starting putting in that money in a locked mutual fund that will earn a middle class worker MILLIONS instead of them hoping to collect the paltry $1200 a month from Socialist Security? Think what small businesses could do with that extra 7.5% that they are no longer having to spend on payroll because it's not needed!

deathdawg (2/16/2008)

What is your argument for the insurance companies that refuse coverage for diabetics and others with chronic illness? Should those people just pay for it out of pocket? I mean $1 a day should cover it right?

If I were diabetic I'd be covered. United Healthcare is my provider. Not crazy about their prescription drug policy but all things considered, it's hard for me to complain. If it were privatized drugs would be cheaper, medical services would be cheaper, insurance would be cheaper (since it would cost less to treat). Not sure what the "$1 a day" comment is about since I've made no such comment. As for those people's situations, not a whole lot to go on as far as the situation goes. That's like asking "My computer doesn't work, what should I do?"

deathdawg (2/16/2008)

Should we entertain ideas to streamline the industry to reduce cost or just leave things the way there are and hope that people crawl out of poverty so they can afford to pay $850 a month + 20% of actual cost?

We should get government out of it and let competition take over for starters. I'm also a believer in Medical Savings Accounts and making all medical expenditures tax deductible. I don't know of many that work for a company and pay that kind of insurance cost. You can't compare an everyday worker to someone who is self-employed it's entirely different.

By the way, HMO's are the result of government involvement in healthcare and the Democratic solution is to involve the government more? I don't think so.

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brittle pete (2/16/2008)
Mugzy12 (2/16/2008)
u mean extremist VS. America..right?...Obama wont stand up for the Pledge of the legeance lol how ever u say it....hes disrespectful to it and hes an extrimist....and if he does get pres. watch out u might be seing some bombs in america...

THIS IS JUST STUPID

There's a lot of it going around these days. Seems like AFMB got infested with a whole nest full of stupid this last week.

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Most people know that we as a country are headed in the WRONG direction.

Most of this WRONG direction can be attributed to the current administration.

Obama would be a stark contrast to the current adminstration therefore sending us in the opposite direction.

If in fact we are headed in the wrong direction, Obama would right the ship.

If we continue to entertain the ideals of preemtive war we will slip further back and become more ostrisized by the world. Our moral credibility in the world has been tremendously damaged over the last 7 years.

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deathdawg (2/16/2008)
Most people know that we as a country are headed in the WRONG direction.

Most of this WRONG direction can be attributed to the current administration.

Obama would be a stark contrast to the current adminstration therefore sending us in the opposite direction.

If in fact we are headed in the wrong direction, Obama would right the ship.

If we continue to entertain the ideals of preemtive war we will slip further back and become more ostrisized by the world. Our moral credibility in the world has been tremendously damaged over the last 7 years.

Our directional problems predated this administration by decades. And while they did very little to solve any of the issues, Obama will do nothing but add a new face and better rhetoric to the age old problem of bad governance. Getting us out of Iraq will be like giving a face lift to a cancer patient. Sure, we might have a better image, but we're still dying. And who knows, it may still put us in more danger.

Dear Government,

Can you solve all of my problems for me, and allow me to be devoid of negative consequences?

Sincerely,

Idiot Citizen

Dear Idiot Citizen,

Yes we can!

Yours Truly,

Barak Obama

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ATLBear (2/17/2008)
deathdawg (2/16/2008)
Most people know that we as a country are headed in the WRONG direction.

Most of this WRONG direction can be attributed to the current administration.

Obama would be a stark contrast to the current adminstration therefore sending us in the opposite direction.

If in fact we are headed in the wrong direction, Obama would right the ship.

If we continue to entertain the ideals of preemtive war we will slip further back and become more ostrisized by the world. Our moral credibility in the world has been tremendously damaged over the last 7 years.

Our directional problems predated this administration by decades. And while they did very little to solve any of the issues, Obama will do nothing but add a new face and better rhetoric to the age old problem of bad governance. Getting us out of Iraq will be like giving a face lift to a cancer patient. Sure, we might have a better image, but we're still dying. And who knows, it may still put us in more danger.

Dear Government,

Can you solve all of my problems for me, and allow me to be devoid of negative consequences?

Sincerely,

Idiot Citizen

Dear Idiot Citizen,

Yes we can!

Yours Truly,

Barak Obama

Sounds like you are defeated and have given up...

LOST HOPE.

An American without hope doesn't even feel American, we were founded on HOPE.

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capologist (2/16/2008)
deathdawg (2/16/2008)

Privatized is fine, but we are feeling the crunch of PRIVATE mortgage companies that went unregulated. Government should be there to govern or balance, but instead we turned our back and now the middle class is hurting.

There's plenty of banking regulations (I spent 6 years as a banker so I'm well-versed). There's the Truth In Lending Act for starters. If a consumer's rights under TILA has been violated they have recourse. By the way, I'm about as middle class as it gets and I'm not "hurting". I'm not where I want to be because of some horrible decisions along the way but I'm not "hurting". I think it's a bit melodramatic to characterize it as such. However, if you truly feel that way then why not phase out Socialist Security and starting putting in that money in a locked mutual fund that will earn a middle class worker MILLIONS instead of them hoping to collect the paltry $1200 a month from Socialist Security? Think what small businesses could do with that extra 7.5% that they are no longer having to spend on payroll because it's not needed!

deathdawg (2/16/2008)

What is your argument for the insurance companies that refuse coverage for diabetics and others with chronic illness? Should those people just pay for it out of pocket? I mean $1 a day should cover it right?

If I were diabetic I'd be covered. United Healthcare is my provider. Not crazy about their prescription drug policy but all things considered, it's hard for me to complain. If it were privatized drugs would be cheaper, medical services would be cheaper, insurance would be cheaper (since it would cost less to treat). Not sure what the "$1 a day" comment is about since I've made no such comment. As for those people's situations, not a whole lot to go on as far as the situation goes. That's like asking "My computer doesn't work, what should I do?"

deathdawg (2/16/2008)

Should we entertain ideas to streamline the industry to reduce cost or just leave things the way there are and hope that people crawl out of poverty so they can afford to pay $850 a month + 20% of actual cost?

We should get government out of it and let competition take over for starters. I'm also a believer in Medical Savings Accounts and making all medical expenditures tax deductible. I don't know of many that work for a company and pay that kind of insurance cost. You can't compare an everyday worker to someone who is self-employed it's entirely different.

By the way, HMO's are the result of government involvement in healthcare and the Democratic solution is to involve the government more? I don't think so.

Obviously, you are going to let one photograph of a moment of distraction sway your vote. Otherwise, I'm sure you would be out campaigning for Obama, right?

And, it is clear how much he hates America from his speeches, his service to America, and how all of his supporters share his contempt.

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deathdawg (2/16/2008)
Most people know that we as a country are headed in the WRONG direction.

Most of this WRONG direction can be attributed to the current administration.

Obama would be a stark contrast to the current adminstration therefore sending us in the opposite direction.

If in fact we are headed in the wrong direction, Obama would right the ship.

If we continue to entertain the ideals of preemtive war we will slip further back and become more ostrisized by the world. Our moral credibility in the world has been tremendously damaged over the last 7 years.

Not sound logic. Just because W's administration has gone the wrong direction doesn't equate to Obama's going the right direction.

More like two extremes that are equally as bad for the country IMO...

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capologist (2/17/2008)
deathdawg (2/16/2008)
Most people know that we as a country are headed in the WRONG direction.

Most of this WRONG direction can be attributed to the current administration.

Obama would be a stark contrast to the current adminstration therefore sending us in the opposite direction.

If in fact we are headed in the wrong direction, Obama would right the ship.

If we continue to entertain the ideals of preemtive war we will slip further back and become more ostrisized by the world. Our moral credibility in the world has been tremendously damaged over the last 7 years.

Not sound logic. Just because W's administration has gone the wrong direction doesn't equate to Obama's going the right direction.

More like two extremes that are equally as bad for the country IMO...

"Extreme"?

Please show me exactly where ANYTHING in Obama's tax policy imposes a greater burden than W's other than those in the top 1% or $200,000+ earners?

He endorses keeping ALL of W's tax cuts other than those I described above. Which makes him less "extreme" than Bill Clinton (who had a Republican congress for 75% of his term) and, if you went back and checked, probably about as "extreme" as Ronald Reagan.

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deathdawg (2/17/2008)Sounds like you are defeated and have given up...

LOST HOPE.

An American without hope doesn't even feel American, we were founded on HOPE.

We were founded on much more than hope. But using your word, an American doesn't seek hope from his/her government. An American finds hope and resolve from within. In that I have all the hope in the world. It's why our founders sought maximum individual liberty and economic freedom. The fact that some believe we should continue to exchange that purpose for a government that defines hope and opportunity for us is what bothers me. That's not hope, that's servitude.
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holymoses (2/17/2008)

Obviously, you are going to let one photograph of a moment of distraction sway your vote. Otherwise, I'm sure you would be out campaigning for Obama, right?

And, it is clear how much he hates America from his speeches, his service to America, and how all of his supporters share his contempt.

Dude, can you quit with the over the top drama? Let's just discuss the stuff without all the emotional junk.

You can't take a perfectly legitimate answer to a question and disguise it as my whole reason for not supporting Obama. Nor has anyone said he "hates America" etc. That's just nonsense.

I don't buy into to socialized medicine/universal healthcare. I don't want to "save" Social Security, I want to phase it OUT. I don't want more entitlements, I want less need for them by cutting government back. I don't want to "sock it to the rich" because they are doing enough quite frankly and without them people don't have jobs.

There's also the different philosophical issues I have on the social side as well.

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