I've been hearing about Mitt Romney's religion (sp?).

[The_ ATL]

And that alot of people wouldnt vote for him because of it. What is it about mormonism that is so bad? I tried doing so research on the beliefs but cant really find anything bad or controversial about it.

So I'm asking what the big deal with mormonism is? I dont want a religious debate just a simple answer about the religion itself.

[deathdawg]

I think that the problem is that the mainstream protestants do not think that the mormons are "true" christians. Probably because they believe that Jesus came over here to the USA before it was the USA and taught the indians about loving kindness and peace; that is not in their bible so it didn't happen... kind of attitude. Also the mormons also used to take more than one wife and this also doesn't fit in the mainstream christian idea of acceptable, even though the book they hold so dear is filled with stories of men of god with mulitiple wives. Take Solomon for instance, he probably had the most wives of anyone in history and yet he was called WISE!!!! lol

my wisdom tells me one is enough for me....

[plainsong]

while i am not a mormon my best friend is. ive been to his stake (church) a few times and nothing really out of the ordinary. a few things he told me were:

1. that after jesus was killed he came to america to preach to the people here.

2. they believe that the garden of eden is in america somewhere (location not exact but they think its in the ohio area)

3. they believe in the bible but they also use the book of mormon as a supplement to god's word.

4. old thinking in the church was that black people (and dark skin people for that matter i.e. native americans, pacific islanders, etc.) were cursed by god and were not allowed to hold positions in the church. he said that was changed years ago and is no longer relevent.

5. they do not believe in polygamy although there are some offshoots of the church that still practice it but it is not condoned by the official church and they are not considered mormon.

6. he mentioned that when they die they are given a universe where they are allowed to rule it. ( i have looked for this and have never found it in any literature so i could never confirm that stance).

there are a few others but i cant remember. sometimes the people there are a little strange (but so are most religions in my opinion). overall they are pretty polite nice people who just do their thing.

[The_ ATL]

But even non-christians seen to oppose the Mormon religion, I'm assuming those examples of more than one wife were ages ago and not now so whats the big deal about this religion?

[The_ ATL]

plainsong (12/13/2007)

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while i am not a mormon my best friend is. ive been to his stake (church) a few times and nothing really out of the ordinary. a few things he told me were:

1. that after jesus was killed he came to america to preach to the people here.

2. they believe that the garden of eden is in america somewhere (location not exact but they think its in the ohio area)

3. they believe in the bible but they also use the book of mormon as a supplement to god's word.

4. old thinking in the church was that black people (and dark skin people for that matter i.e. native americans, pacific islanders, etc.) were cursed by god and were not allowed to hold positions in the church. he said that was changed years ago and is no longer relevent.

5. they do not believe in polygamy although there are some offshoots of the church that still practice it but it is not condoned by the official church and they are not considered mormon.

6. he mentioned that when they die they are given a universe where they are allowed to rule it. ( i have looked for this and have never found it in any literature so i could never confirm that stance).

there are a few others but i cant remember. sometimes the people there are a little strange (but so are most religions in my opinion). overall they are pretty polite nice people who just do their thing.

Thanks for some of that info plainsong, I'm still researching as to what its all about. Its not a huge deal I've just been in this religion type mood over the last year and want to find some things out.

[The_ ATL]

I also found this which talks about the Mormon Theology.

http://nowscape.com/mormon/mormons4.htm

If I'm reading it right they believe there are multiple gods and not just one God? And that Jesus created the Earth as a god and then lived here for x amount of years and that God isnt Jesus' father but somone else?

Wow this religion is confusing as **** (no pun intented).

[Kevin Stevens]

Try this site if you want to learn about the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (Mormons)

http://www.lds.org/

[triggerman]

yeah they also don't beleive in caffiene or alcohol..........he MIGHT BAN CAFFIENE!!!!!!!!!!!!

[falcnfan77]

I was a devout Mormon for 15 years. Converted when I was 18, went on a mission and held several leadership positions, married in the temple, and served in several leadership positions (i.e. Elders Quorum President, memberof branch presidency, etc.).

After several years of internet reseach, I resigned in 2002 because Mormonism is the 19th centuries answer to Scientology. Some nice people with very good hearts and high moral standards, some weird control freaks in leadership positions, but overall it's a cult. It's founder, Joseph Smith was a meglomaniac and a child molester who invented Mormonism as a family business and ego trip.

I usually don't get into discussing "The Church" anymore, but I hate for people to be sucked into Gordon Hinckley's billion dollar propaganda machine. I encourage you to go to www.lds.org but also try:

http://home.teleport.com/~packham/index.htm

It's exMormon Richard Packham's site and it explores the dark side of Mormonism. Richard is a retired attorney and really nice guy. It's a good place to start learning what Mormons don't want you to know about their religion.

Also, feel free to ask me any questions you might have. I'll give you an honest answer instead of "the milk before the meat".

[falcnfan77]

Another point I like to make about Mormonism is if it is just another religion, why does Utah have the highest anti-depressant use in the United States? A good article on what Mormonism does to women:

http://home.teleport.com/~packham/prozac.htm

[triggerman]

I think the south parks guys have it out for the Mormons for some reason, perhaps you can use them as a barometer of the religion

[octoslash]

I prefer to withhold judgement until Governor Romney receives his due process.

[MilAfterLife]

The_ ATL (12/13/2007)

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And that alot of people wouldnt vote for him because of it. What is it about mormonism that is so bad? I tried doing so research on the beliefs but cant really find anything bad or controversial about it.

So I'm asking what the big deal with mormonism is? I dont want a religious debate just a simple answer about the religion itself.

Maybe people are worried that the mormon church will start exerting its influence over the US, by way of Romney. I know I would not like that very much! 3.2 beer? Strict religious codes? No caffeine?

I wish that the politicians could stand on their principle and backgrounds, instead most are so blinded by the words Jesus and Abortion that they would willingly sell this country down the river to support a candidate that holds the same beliefs in those two categories only.

[robpanama]

All I know is that at my cousins wedding in a mormon church the non mormons were persona non grata, so apparently there is something to hide. Oh and I will never ever ever build a LDS project again, their specs are fubar beyond govt.

[falcnfan77]

robpanama (12/14/2007)

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(snip) Oh and I will never ever ever build a LDS project again, their specs are fubar beyond govt.

We call that "getting the "pay-lay-ale":D

You will also notice that "Kevin Stevens" registered just to steer people to a pro-LDS site. I, along with other exMormons have long suspected that the Mormon Church monitors the internet for any potential converts. Believe me, we did some pretty strange things while I was a missionary to get people sucked into the cult.

[savwboy9]

Someone correct me if I am wrong , but does not LDS believe that Jesus and Lucifer are brothers?

[falcnfan77]

savwboy savwboy (12/14/2007)

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Someone correct me if I am wrong , but does not LDS believe that Jesus and Lucifer are brothers?

This is the way it goes according to the Mormons:

Before the earth was formed, we all lived in heaven with God (Heavenly Father) and a Heavenly Mother (or mothers if you listen to Brigham Young and the other ealy Mormon leaders) near a star named Kolob. All of us (including Jesus and Satan) were children of Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother. So the Father presented a plan for us to

A. Come to earth.

B. Get a body and be tested.

C. Keep the commandments so that we could return to live with him and be gods of our own planets.

Satan wanted to make everyone be good. Jesus wanted to give everyone free will. So Jesus and Satan (along with their followers) got into a big fight (war in heaven) and Satan and his follers were cast out. Until 1978 most Mormon leaders taught that in the fight black people were on the sidelines and didn't fight for or against Jesus so they were cursed with a black skin. Of course Mormon leaders today don't want to discuss that past belief for obvious reasons.

So Jesus and Satan are brothers in Mormon belief in the sense that they have the same parents. But to Mormons it's like the relationship between Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader. Yeah they are related...but that's it. One is evil and the other one is good.

[atlfan25]

falcnfan77 (12/15/2007)

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savwboy savwboy (12/14/2007)

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Someone correct me if I am wrong , but does not LDS believe that Jesus and Lucifer are brothers?

This is the way it goes according to the Mormons:

Before the earth was formed, we all lived in heaven with God (Heavenly Father) and a Heavenly Mother (or mothers if you listen to Brigham Young and the other ealy Mormon leaders) near a star named Kolob. All of us (including Jesus and Satan) were children of Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother. So the Father presented a plan for us to

A. Come to earth.

B. Get a body and be tested.

C. Keep the commandments so that we could return to live with him and be gods of our own planets.

Satan wanted to make everyone be good. Jesus wanted to give everyone free will. So Jesus and Satan (along with their followers) got into a big fight (war in heaven) and Satan and his follers were cast out. Until 1978 most Mormon leaders taught that in the fight black people were on the sidelines and didn't fight for or against Jesus so they were cursed with a black skin. Of course Mormon leaders today don't want to discuss that past belief for obvious reasons.

So Jesus and Satan are brothers in Mormon belief in the sense that they have the same parents. But to Mormons it's like the relationship between Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader. Yeah they are related...but that's it. One is evil and the other one is good.

When was the Book of Mormon written and how did the founder come upon this information? I've seen the south park episode about Joseph Smith but you can't really trust those guys.

I'm a Christian and some of those Mormon ideas you said seem completely crazy.

[falcnfan77]

You can get a good picture of what Mormons believe today about the Book of Mormon here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Mormon

To be very brief, Joseph Smith and his family were into folk magic. One of the things they participated in was looking for buried treasure. That's where Smith most likely got the idea for finding "gold plates" buried in the side of a hill. Also, there was a big debate at the time about where the American Indians came from. Ethan Smith (no relation) had just written A View of the Hebrews that claimed that Indians were part of the Ten Lost Tribes.

The Book of Mormon itself isn't really much different in it's teaching from Biblical Christianity. What most people don't know is that it was not until after the Book of Mormon came out that Smith began teaching strange doctrines foreign to mainstream Christianity. Ideas such as plurality of gods, men becoming gods, polygamy being essential to salvation, the entire temple ritual as well as a host of other doctrines are not in the Book of Mormon.

There is no evidence that a vast civilization of Nephites and Lamanites (the two Book of Mormon peoples) were ever in Central America. But this will never bother Mormons because they feel like it all happened.

The facts say otherwise. The populations talked about in the Book of Mormon are impossiblehttp://www.josephlied.com/population.html

DNA research proves Mormon claims falsehttp://www.signaturebooks.com/Losing.htm

Like Scientology, Mormonism will continue to provide the willing believer with a fantastic fairy tale.

[Kevin Stevens]

falcnfan77 (12/14/2007)

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robpanama (12/14/2007)

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You will also notice that "Kevin Stevens" registered just to steer people to a pro-LDS site. I, along with other exMormons have long suspected that the Mormon Church monitors the internet for any potential converts. Believe me, we did some pretty strange things while I was a missionary to get people sucked into the cult.

Notice that falcnfan77 wants to be a mind reader some day :P Needs more practice I think.

All I did was direct the poster to a web site that could answer some questions which is what the orginal poster wanted.

[falcnfan77]

Kevin Stevens (12/16/2007)

Notice that falcnfan77 wants to be a mind reader some day :P Needs more practice I think.

All I did was direct the poster to a web site that could answer some questions which is what the orginal poster wanted.

I don't think that you will get too many questions answered at that site although it is worth a look to understand the cult mindset.

I just thought it was strange that someone would register just to steer people to an LDS site. Are you a long time Falcon fan?

[kschreck]

It is kind of interesting that he has posted in no other thread, and didn't even really try to deny what you said.

Things that make you go hmmmmm......................

[Anon]

falcnfan77 (12/16/2007)

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Kevin Stevens (12/16/2007)

Notice that falcnfan77 wants to be a mind reader some day :P Needs more practice I think.

All I did was direct the poster to a web site that could answer some questions which is what the orginal poster wanted.

I don't think that you will get too many questions answered at that site although it is worth a look to understand the cult mindset.

I just thought it was strange that someone would register just to steer people to an LDS site. Are you a long time Falcon fan?

When and how did you transition out of the Church of LDS?

Why did you stop believing?

[The_ ATL]

I have read several things that make me think that the Mormon religion is like a crazy sci-fi movie.

Belief that when you die you go to another galaxy and await transport to another planet where your sole purpose is to make spirit babys that go to earth as well as other planets.

Jesus created Earth and it is a form of god. Jesus and the Devil are half brothers and that God's body isnt filled with blood but instead a powder that allows him to breath in outer space.

Those are just some things I've found so far but I can believe that some people think that stuff is real.

Another question. Are all Mormon churches the same or do they teach the religion in different ways? My wife's family attends Mormon services but they seem to have Christian beliefs. Do different churches (Mormon) teach different things?

[plainsong]

i sent over that link from nowscape that was listed earlier in the thread to my friend that was raised as a mormon. he read it and this was his response.

""Sounds like a bunch of anti stuff that they always put out. Nobody talks like that in our church. We don't have lessons on planet Kolob or the make of spiritual bodies. We don't care about who's who in the Godhead near as much as your average "Christians" seem to. That's the one thing they always go to is the "Trinity" just like our English teacher used to. It's their thing, I guess. That and the line they use about not having to do good works on earth to get to heaven. They feel like grace is the only way so why worry about what you do while you're here.

Apparently it's written mockingly but they use a few truths and intermingle them with BS in order to twist and turn it all around to make it sound weird and unconventional as a religion. Just like the way the media teases Scientology for all their "weird" teachings. I don't know anything about them but I would imagine that they aren't as weird as they would have us believe. If people want to know about LDS they can go to LDS.org which is the official website of the church. Anytime you see a quote from a Mormon Prophet like Brigham Young or someone they always show where it came from and it's usually "Journal of Discourses" or something like "Mormom Doctrine". Those books aren't official church books. They are written by people who have their own opinions and they aren't used in the church to teach official doctrine so you can't go by what they say. it would be like someone recording what you said at a home meeting and then over the years putting it into a book form and then people quoting you on what you said when it was mostly just conversations with other church members at passing. The "official" teachings come from the pulpit. Our church never makes new statements or teachings behind the scenes and then passes it down by word of mouth. it just doesn't work that way. All that planet crap is just speculation of probably EX-mormons and you know how all the "former" members of any church seem to know EVERYTHING about that church.""

My question for the "Christians" is this: "if everyone that doesnt believe in what you believe is wrong then how do YOU explain it?". They never can. Just "accept Jesus into your heart" and all is well and you can live in eternity floating on a cloud playing a harp, I guess. Doesn't sound so blissful to me. It would be nice if an Evangelical Christian had some answers for once. They can tell you what's wrong but can't seem to tell you what's right.

I find it funny, myself.