maxatlanta

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  1. I never argued against your point that execution has cost us ball games. So I'm not going to go try and prove otherwise. Its good to see you reference some of the top play callers. Whether we are executing well or not, the comparison of Sark to other play callers is a valid topic of discussion. One that gets sidetracked because in people's minds somehow us executing poorly = can't debate if Sark is the best man for the job. That's not logical. Sark can be good, and someone else can be better. No one has to prove Sark is bad in order to justify thinking someone else is a better OC.
  2. I totally agree. I also think if Shanny were still here we'd have won a couple more games.
  3. I think you're going to have a more productive discussion now. It may be immatertial to the title of the thread, but not to the larger discussion of whether we can improve our team by upgrading at OC. I think most posters recognize how badly the drops in particular have hurt us. We just don't all agree that the execution problems mean Sark gives us the best chance at a title (over bringing in Kubiak). We improved a great deal under Shanahan from year 1 to year two. Obviously improvement should be expected from year 1 to year 2 in a new system. This is year 3, so we don't have the benefit of being dramatically more comfortable in the system. We already know the verbiage, blocking schemes, route combos, and core plays. Shanny outsmarted defenses in year two by creating mismatches. He said himself that he made lots of changes and added new wrinkles over the offseason(and does so every year). I'll point out that both Shanny and Sark get the benefit of knowing their personnel better in yr2. Shanny got the benefit of cleaning up execution from our Center(snaps and general inconsistent play), while Sark should benefit from better execution by our receivers(though Shanny fixed the problem by bringing in Mack, Sark will need the current drop perpetrators to fix it themselves). I hope Sark is the answer for us. I just don't think that because Shanny went ham in yr two, we should expect Sark to as well. I think there's potential for upgrading and until now haven't been able to have that discussion because it goes straight into our execution problems. Until your post above, I don't recall anyone both defending Sark and also aknowledging there is a discussion to be had about whether we should bring in Kubiak.
  4. It seems to me that PMF is making his case that Sark has been good enough for us to potentially have a couple more wins and a top 10 offense, had we executed better. Some of us are capable of agreeing with this, yet still recognizing that we have one of the most talented offenses in the league and top 10 is underachieving. And please don't make the case that we would be better than top 10, because it's unrealistic for any team to never drop passes, miss blocks, or miss open receivers. If your argument starts with "if we had perfect execution," then it's not realistic. For some reason, the people defending the job Sark has done this year have a tough time admitting he also is not among the top tier of OCs. If you have watched LAR, NE, PHI, NO... then you can see what it looks like when an elite play caller has good talent to work with. I don't know why the folks here defending Sark can't also aknowledge that he isn't yet an elite coordinator. He hasn't earned that classification. There's only a handful of them out there. I can't think of anybody available other than Kubiak that I'd be confident about giving us a better chance to win, and I don't want to see us change systems.
  5. Levitre was up and down last season. Chester was the weak link. So we're a little worse off this year but not dramatically so. Our OL benefited greatly from the unpredictability we had last year. Couldn't tell by personnel or formation whether it was run or pass coming. Throw in all the bootleg, outside zbs, and play action stuff, and a bunch of screens- it really made their jobs easier.
  6. I didn't want to bump it because I didn't need to keep making the same point. But the answer is that if we're assuming the players are executing well, top 10 is under achieving with our talent. Last year is proof of what these players in this system are capable of. That doesn't mean anything less than #1 offense is underachieving, but it definitely means being outside the top 5 is.
  7. You did not describe a well run offense. And you called Sark a bad play caller. I'm not sure what your point is other than everyone needs to perform better, including our OC(at least if championship caliber play is the bar we're setting). I'd agree with that.
  8. Let's put aside placing blame on anybody. Is it really LOL for fans to recognize our offense is scoring 11pts less per game this year? There's a thread today discussing how our defense finally played at a championship caliber on Thursday night. Wouldn't you like to see us play championship caliber offense consistently?
  9. Clearly Sarkisian has made some good play calls, clearly Ryan and/or the receivers have missed opportunities with poor execution. Clearly Sarkisian is not incompetent. With that out of the way, is it so bad to ask if he is among the top OCs in the league? I'd like folks to move on from explaining how Sark is doing a good job, because that's not the question I'm posing. It's is he as good as McDermott/Lafluer, Payton, McDaniels, Shanny... and most interesting to me- Is he as good as Kubiak, who might actually be available for next year?
  10. I thought you weren't trying to put words in my mouth. I gave Sark credit for orchestrating what would be a top 10 offense if not for the drops. Then I said that's not good enough with the talent we have here. Read my post, I went out of my way to be clear and did list the elements that are lacking this year. I don't need to write a term paper just to have an opinion, and mine is that recognizing the execution failures of the players has made a lot of fans overlook the fact that our OC is not putting us in as good position to succeed as the top OCs in the league do. And like any reasonable fan, I was unhappy with Shanny in year 1, and loved him last year. Why would anyone love him after year 1? Why would anyone hate him after year 2? Edit: Lol, don't answer that last question.
  11. Nice post. A fine tuned NFL offense can be derailed by just 1 person screwing up. Placing the blame on 1 guy only applies to individual plays though. The truth is always more complicated and each of the things you mentioned is part of it. Quinn needs an "Assistant Head Coach" who actually assists him with in game decision making. Last night: We missed a challenge opportunity on a catch they made that hit the ground and moved. We failed to call TO after the Gabriel catch. We should have accepted the 10 yard penalty. Ryan has been uncharacteristically inaccurate with his placement and missed open reads. Sark hasn't provided the unpredictability, mismatches, and wide open looks that we saw a year ago. He hasn't used our RBs to their strengths enough. The recievers have dropped a lot of balls. Kick coverage this year has been rough. On the bright side, our defense is good and getting better. We're talented enough to have all these problems and still be in the thick of the division and wc hunt.
  12. This is what I'm talking about. Why is it that the players not executing automatically means Sark is doing a great job? We would not be a top 5 offense in scoring even if you eliminated half our drops. You are "copping out" by using the drops as an excuse to not compare the job Sark has done to other OCs that are doing it better.
  13. I'm not giving the receivers a pass. I tried to be blunt that they are at fault. My point is that people seem to think Sark is doing a great job because the receivers have dropped so many balls, and we would be a top 10 offense if not for that. To me that is goving Sark a pass. Top 10 is underachieving for this group IMO.
  14. Are you saying that a great OC doesn't give his players an advantage? Receivers are at fault when they drop passes. Players not executing isn't evidence that the OC is doing a great job. They are not mutually exclusive.
  15. First off, great win! But something has bugged me for a while... Last season we consistently had plays that schemed our receivers(RBs included) open. Every game, and especially during the scripted 15, we would see someone running free due to cunning route combos, misdirection, and combined with strategic personnel packages that created mismatches. Later in the game we'd see adjustments and calls that were set up earlier in the contest. Do you think those elements helped get us in a rhythm? Can an OC help players execute better by putting them in position to succeed- through favorable match ups, deception, and especially by keeping the defense guessing as to what play is coming next? I've seen a lot posted about how Sark has put us in position to score but being 2nd in drops has cost us. Well, that's all true. But would a better OC help our players execution by making their job easier? And if we were dropping balls at a league average rate, and thus around the top 10 in scoring, would that mean that he's maximizing our talent on offense? I think we should be top 3 in scoring based on our talent. We badly miss the advantage of a handful of snaps each game with "easy" reads for the QB, mismatches for the receivers, and defenses confused by what we're doing. You see that stuff every game with NE, NO(like their opening drive last night and their TD pass to that rookie), PHI, and LAR. YES, the drops are killing us and they are the fault of the WR. But that doesn't mean Sark is doing a great job. It's not one or the other. Both are performing well below the level we see from the best in the league.