Goober Pyle

Dontari Poe might be out of Falcons' price range

65 posts in this topic

Caps gonna be a problem for the Falcons, especially with Jakes contract coming up soon and our young defensive players coming up later. 

 

When you have Matt, Julio, Alex Mack, and now Tru and Freeman...I don't see how Poe signs here. 

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Posted (edited)

19 minutes ago, I Even Bleed Red said:

Caps gonna be a problem for the Falcons, especially with Jakes contract coming up soon and our young defensive players coming up later. 

 

When you have Matt, Julio, Alex Mack, and now Tru and Freeman...I don't see how Poe signs here. 

Seems like about the only time the cap isn't a problem for a team is when they either have no QB to speak of, or get lucky and hit on a rookie starting QB.  Look at the teams with the most cap room:

  1. San Francisco - No QB
  2. Cleveland - No QB
  3. Tennessee - Marcus Mariota : still on rookie contract
  4. Jacksonville - Blake Bortles : still on rookie contract
  5. Oakland Raiders - Derek Carr : still on rookie contract
Edited by brewman

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19 minutes ago, I Even Bleed Red said:

Caps gonna be a problem for the Falcons, especially with Jakes contract coming up soon and our young defensive players coming up later. 

 

When you have Matt, Julio, Alex Mack, and now Tru and Freeman...I don't see how Poe signs here. 

We'll have to make some tough decisions, but Dimitroff's done a good job of staggering when players are free agents and need to get paid.

2018 - Trufant, Freeman - $47 mil cap space - 32 players under contract (after 2017 and 2018 draft class will be 46 under contract)
2019 - Matt Ryan, Jake Mathews, Tevin Coleman, Grady Jarrett - $86 mil in cap space - 17 players under contract (after 2017-2019 draft classes will be 38 under contract)
2020 - Vic Beasley, Deion Jones, Austin Hooper, De'Vondre Campbell - $120 mil in cap space - 6 players under contract (after 2017-2020 draft classes will be 35 under contract)

Of course a couple won't make the cut, but we are in a pretty good position to keep our own.

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Vaughan McClure: "Falcons coach Dan Quinn said he had a "good visit" with Dontari Poe and wants him to be on the team. Quinn said the Falcons discussed an offer with Poe. "I liked him," Quinn said. Now Falcons just awaiting word with Poe visiting Dolphins."

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Just now, jfalconsp said:

Vaughan McClure: "Falcons coach Dan Quinn said he had a "good visit" with Dontari Poe and wants him to be on the team. Quinn said the Falcons discussed an offer with Poe. "I liked him," Quinn said. Now Falcons just awaiting word with Poe visiting Dolphins."

I think most of us see it like this:

1.) The Phins pays his asking price;

2.) Poe sees the Phins as SB contenders AND pays his asking price; OR

3.) Poe sees the Phins as SB contenders and lowers his asking price; OR

4.) Poe sees he's not going to get better and signs with Falcons (who are already a SB-caliber team) at a lower price. (best case scenario for us)

 

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1 hour ago, Sui_Generis said:

I really wished Ryan would go the Brady route and take a sizeable amount, but not beat out Lucks contract. 

But I am afraid that is not the case. Yet, one more reason why Brady can't be human. That guys drive to win is insane. 

I think the same way.  Chipper Jones did the same.  I would want to win more than make a couple few extra million.  + winning gets you more endorsements, and you could make all of that money back easily.

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1 hour ago, g-dawg said:

Regarding the cap, Falcons are entering a new phase that they have not been in during the Dimitroff regime - and this is not a swipe at TD so please don't turn it into this.    We now have a stacked roster with players in the pipeline deserving of big raises in the coming years.    Could we steal money from the future to make more cap space now?  Sure.....Matt Ryan's contract is a big place to steal money now - but it will cost you later - not sure that is the route to take.

Falcons are going to have to be very strategic (and careful!) going forward.

This FO has always handled the cap well. Do wonder what Ryan's next extension will be like, I hope he takes less money overall in exchange for more guaranteed money. Which is what Brady did.

Real key is to keep drafting well so that they don't have to overpay their own players. If they show they can draft well at the back ends of rounds, they'll be in great shape going forward.

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15 minutes ago, Statick said:

I think most of us see it like this:

1.) The Phins pays his asking price;

2.) Poe sees the Phins as SB contenders AND pays his asking price; OR

3.) Poe sees the Phins as SB contenders and lowers his asking price; OR

4.) Poe sees he's not going to get better and signs with Falcons (who are already a SB-caliber team) at a lower price. (best case scenario for us)

 

NO ONE sees Phins as SB contenders.....c'mon Man!

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I'll say up front, I don't know that much about Poe, but I will say I am leary of overpaying FA's.  

I'm sure there are more, but I can only recall a few of these actually working out well. 

Mack, Sanu, Abraham.  Seems many of them take the money and then skate for a few years.  If we are going to do FA for starters, I think out best luck has been with Offensive Lineman.  

I'm ready for the draft.  

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1 minute ago, falconidae said:

This FO has always handled the cap well. Do wonder what Ryan's next extension will be like, I hope he takes less money overall in exchange for more guaranteed money. Which is what Brady did.

Real key is to keep drafting well so that they don't have to overpay their own players. If they show they can draft well at the back ends of rounds, they'll be in great shape going forward.

"always handled cap well"....Falcons have NEVER had this many talented players.

and never more than 1-2 on defensive side.  It is manageable now - will be very difficult in 1-2yrs.

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1 minute ago, g-dawg said:

"always handled cap well"....Falcons have NEVER had this many talented players.

and never more than 1-2 on defensive side.  It is manageable now - will be very difficult in 1-2yrs.

I dread the inevitability of having to lose some of the guys we have. I mean we got 10-11 starters out of the last two drafts and there's no realistic way they all stay. 

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Just now, ATLFalcon36 said:

I dread the inevitability of having to lose some of the guys we have. I mean we got 10-11 starters out of the last two drafts and there's no realistic way they all stay. 

Keep drafting well and that problem takes care of itself. Just not something we've been accustomed to at all in the past.

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1 minute ago, g-dawg said:

"always handled cap well"....Falcons have NEVER had this many talented players.

and never more than 1-2 on defensive side.  It is manageable now - will be very difficult in 1-2yrs.

So? lots of teams get in cap trouble without a lot of talent on the team.  Think the fact the falcons have handled the cap well so far is a good sign. And, seems like they've got it set up pretty well.  In 19 and 20, several big contracts will be gone or cut- Levitre, Shelby, Reed,Clayborn- Sanu, Toilolo and Alford can all be cut easily. Bryant will probably be replaced by someone much cheaper.

If they keep drafting well, they'll be good.

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Extending your own talent costs less than signing FAs. So long as the Falcons draft well and avoid lousy contracts like Jackon's and Reed's moving forward, they will never be in cap trouble. Every championship team loses a piece every year. It's how you replace those pieces. NE will lose Hightower, let's see how they do without him. 

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2 hours ago, quotemokc said:

Brady also has a wife that is worth $300million.

BFD. Somebody on this board please try to convince me that there could be a situation where someone can live comfortably on $25M/yr and have trouble getting by at $20M/yr. Unless they have a $10M gambling habit.

It is incredibly difficult to spend either one of those sums of money, even being lavish and wasteful. Sure, Matt has earned the right to a bigger contract, but there's absolutely NOTHING that says he has to demand it. Gisselle or no Gisselle. If Matt were smart he'd take $8M a year less than market, under the stipulation it goes to the OL in FA. This would help guarantee both his success AND his long term health. He was under pressure repeatedly in that Super Bowl. In case anyone forgot.

I'm still waiting for a QB to actually figure this out. I was hoping Matt would be the one. Money isn't everything. Every starting QB in the league is already set for life if they're smart. And you HAVE to be smart to play that position.

So when you're retired and 70 years old, what's gonna matter? An extra $30M in the bank, or those rings on your fingers?

C'mon Matty, take a pay CUT and insist it goes to the OL.

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This is textbook Falcons. I touched on this in another thread. The Falcons will not go top dollar, splurge, and will not get into a bidding war for incoming FA's. What they present to you is take it or leave it. We've missed out on numerous talented FA's in the past because of this and I'm not mad about it one bit.

This mindset is what keeps this franchise alive believe it or not. I'd love to have Poe here, he would take this dline to another level. it is what it is...next.

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20 minutes ago, since68andcounting said:

BFD. Somebody on this board please try to convince me that there could be a situation where someone can live comfortably on $25M/yr and have trouble getting by at $20M/yr. Unless they have a $10M gambling habit.

It is incredibly difficult to spend either one of those sums of money, even being lavish and wasteful. Sure, Matt has earned the right to a bigger contract, but there's absolutely NOTHING that says he has to demand it. Gisselle or no Gisselle. If Matt were smart he'd take $8M a year less than market, under the stipulation it goes to the OL in FA. This would help guarantee both his success AND his long term health. He was under pressure repeatedly in that Super Bowl. In case anyone forgot.

I'm still waiting for a QB to actually figure this out. I was hoping Matt would be the one. Money isn't everything. Every starting QB in the league is already set for life if they're smart. And you HAVE to be smart to play that position.

So when you're retired and 70 years old, what's gonna matter? An extra $30M in the bank, or those rings on your fingers?

C'mon Matty, take a pay CUT and insist it goes to the OL.

I don't really think it's fair for us to judge. I doubt any of us has a concept of the difference between 20 and 25 mil per year in terms of earnings. It's like looking at the stars in the sky. We can look at them but because they are so far away we can't judge their size or distance. Plus giving up 30 mil doesn't guarantee Ryan anything.  

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33 minutes ago, E. T. said:

This is textbook Falcons. I touched on this in another thread. The Falcons will not go top dollar, splurge, and will not get into a bidding war for incoming FA's. What they present to you is take it or leave it. We've missed out on numerous talented FA's in the past because of this and I'm not mad about it one bit.

This mindset is what keeps this franchise alive believe it or not. I'd love to have Poe here, he would take this dline to another level. it is what it is...next.

Who???

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30 minutes ago, E. T. said:

This is textbook Falcons. I touched on this in another thread. The Falcons will not go top dollar, splurge, and will not get into a bidding war for incoming FA's. What they present to you is take it or leave it. We've missed out on numerous talented FA's in the past because of this and I'm not mad about it one bit.

This mindset is what keeps this franchise alive believe it or not. I'd love to have Poe here, he would take this dline to another level. it is what it is...next.

agreed and good post.

Falcons are in a position now where they know they have a talented roster which should afford them the ability to compete for NFC South division, playoffs, and potential SuperBowl for another 3-5 yrs....but to do that, we must be able to keep our core players - Matt/Julio/Mack/Jake/Beasley/Jarrett/Tru/Neal and maybe a few more....

We cannot go chasing free agents anymore from other teams.  Remember, the other team let them go - always remember this.  I want Poe but remember this - KC let him go and signed Bennie Logan to a 1yr deal....

To keep our core, something must be sacrificed and that is going to be, most likely, an inability to make big moves in free agency.

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34 minutes ago, since68andcounting said:

BFD. Somebody on this board please try to convince me that there could be a situation where someone can live comfortably on $25M/yr and have trouble getting by at $20M/yr. Unless they have a $10M gambling habit.

It is incredibly difficult to spend either one of those sums of money, even being lavish and wasteful. Sure, Matt has earned the right to a bigger contract, but there's absolutely NOTHING that says he has to demand it. Gisselle or no Gisselle. If Matt were smart he'd take $8M a year less than market, under the stipulation it goes to the OL in FA. This would help guarantee both his success AND his long term health. He was under pressure repeatedly in that Super Bowl. In case anyone forgot.

I'm still waiting for a QB to actually figure this out. I was hoping Matt would be the one. Money isn't everything. Every starting QB in the league is already set for life if they're smart. And you HAVE to be smart to play that position.

So when you're retired and 70 years old, what's gonna matter? An extra $30M in the bank, or those rings on your fingers?

C'mon Matty, take a pay CUT and insist it goes to the OL.

I love when strangers give advice on other people's money :rolleyes:

There have been many many examples of players mismanaging their money to the point where they are selling off superbowl rings to try and make ends meet, so yes there are circumstances where $20M a year can make it hard to not get by, but sustain the quality of life they grow to expect due to their income.

Also, feel free to go to your boss and tell them you will take less money so the company can hire better I.T. people...or Accounting people...if money isn't everything, how many times have you sacrificed your own salary for the sake of someone else?  I'm guessing none.  And I'm not hating on you if you haven't because why would you.  People are out to get top dollar in life, why would anyone voluntarily take less than they are worth?

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3 hours ago, quotemokc said:

Brady also has a wife that is worth $300million.

Ryan has also made in excess of $170 million. I really think Brady would take a pay cut regardless. Winning means that much to him. Have you not seen his insane diet. Avacado ice cream as an effing dessert once every few months!! 

That cat is ate up with all things performance and winning.

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12 minutes ago, athell said:

I love when strangers give advice on other people's money :rolleyes:

There have been many many examples of players mismanaging their money to the point where they are selling off superbowl rings to try and make ends meet, so yes there are circumstances where $20M a year can make it hard to not get by, but sustain the quality of life they grow to expect due to their income.

Also, feel free to go to your boss and tell them you will take less money so the company can hire better I.T. people...or Accounting people...if money isn't everything, how many times have you sacrificed your own salary for the sake of someone else?  I'm guessing none.  And I'm not hating on you if you haven't because why would you.  People are out to get top dollar in life, why would anyone voluntarily take less than they are worth?

I took less money on a salary end for better benefits. My salary is still a very nice sum, but the perks and benefits out weigh the dollar amount I could have made at the company I left. 

I took quite a paycut if I am being honest, but since I have been with the new company I have recouped it rather well. 

Not everyone is out to get top dollar in life. That is a very narrow minded way of thinking. 

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Just now, Sui_Generis said:

I took less money on a salary end for better benefits. My salary is still a very nice sum, but the perks and benefits out weigh the dollar amount I could have made at the company I left. 

I took quite a paycut if I am being honest, but since I have been with the new company I have recouped it rather well. 

Not everyone is out to get top dollar in life. That is a very narrow minded way of thinking. 

I took less money to move from Illinois to Arizona because the markets are different, that is not the point and we aren't talking about benefits.  He is saying that Matt Ryan should voluntarily take less money so other positions could be upgraded.  If your boss came to you and said Sui, if you take a $30K a year decrease in salary, we can get a better HR coordinator, you would say sure where do I sign?

Tbh, it's very narrow minded and ignorant to tell other people how to manage their money and if you think most don't have dollars at the forefront of their mind then I don't know what to tell you.  Sure there are other reasons to change jobs, bosses, benefits like you mentioned, hours, travel, etc. but money is a huge component to every business transaction.  Contracts, jobs etc. are all business transactions at the end of the day.

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