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Saints Fired Spags And Are Switching To A 3-4

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#121 Saintsfan#1

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:16 PM

The New Orleans Times-Picayune names Martez Wilson and Junior Galette as two defenders likeliest to benefit from the Saints' move to a 3-4.

Wilson, a linebacker at Illinois, flashed with three sacks as a nickel pass rusher in 2012 and at 6-foot-4, 252, is built like a 3-4 outside linebacker. Galette, who goes 6-foot-2, 258, racked up five sacks in a rotational role. It's conceivable that Galette and Wilson could open the 2013 season as New Orleans' bookend outside rushers with Cam Jordan and Akiem Hicks on the ends

http://www.nola.com/...itch_to_3-.html

#122 CaliSaint4Life

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:43 PM

Some funny things being said in this thread - like Hicks being small in the lower half of his body. Just makes me wonder do some people even watch the game or know how to evaluate a player. It's ok to have an opinion, but just don't allow yourself to sound ignorant because you hate the opposing team. That's like me saying John Abraham can't rush the passer because I dislike him.

If you take a step back and look at it, then switch to the 3-4 makes perfect sense. Look who we'll be letting go this year: Jon Vilma, Will Smith, and Sed Ellis. All guys who aren't very scheme diverse and need to be in an even front.

Look at who we have. Cam Jordan - prototypical 5-tech. Akeem Hicks - DE in a 2-gap scheme and a 1-tech in a one-gap scheme. Bunkley manned the NT position when Denver was in a 4-3 (Thanks to DawnOfThemBirds for pointing out the mistype) and he played at a high level. I don't think he's a 2-gap NT though. Hawthorne had his best year as a LBer as an ILB for Seattle. Lofton is your prototypical block shedding lineback and would probably be your strongside ILB. Galette and Wilson are better suited for a 3-4 than a 4-3. Most scouts tend to think that their personnal is best suited for the scheme change.

If you look at the other side, there are holes also. If you go 2-gap, who is your big space eating NT? Galette and Wilson have the talent and measurables but are unproven pass rushers. Lofton has never played in a 3-4 and isn't exactly a great coverage player.

The type of coordinator we hire will determine if we run a one-gap or two-gap 3-4. For example: Anyone from the Belicheck tree will probably run a two-gap scheme (Mangini & Crennel).

I'd be nice if a football discussion could be had without personal insults. If anyone wishes to talk about the benefits of a 3-4 and a 4-3 with our current personnel and which 3-4 scheme suits us best (one-gap or two-gap) then lets do it - we could do the same for the Falcons.

Edited by CaliSaint4Life, 25 January 2013 - 03:54 PM.


#123 D.O.T.B.☑

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:50 PM

View PostCaliSaint4Life, on 25 January 2013 - 03:43 PM, said:

Some funny things being said in this thread - like Hicks being small in the lower half of his body. Just makes me wonder do some people even watch the game or know how to evaluate a player. It's ok to have an opinion, but just don't allow yourself to sound ignorant because you hate the opposing team. That's like me saying John Abraham can't rush the passer because I dislike him.

If you take a step back and look at it, then switch to the 3-4 makes perfect sense. Look who we'll be letting go this year: Jon Vilma, Will Smith, and Sed Ellis. All guys who aren't very scheme diverse and need to be in an even front.

Look at who we have. Cam Jordan - prototypical 5-tech. Akeem Hicks - DE in a 2-gap scheme and a 1-tech in a one-gap scheme. Bunkley manned the NT position when Denver was in a 3-4 and he played at a high level. I don't think he's a 2-gap NT though. Hawthorne had his best year as a LBer as an ILB for Seattle. Lofton is your prototypical block shedding lineback and would probably be your strongside ILB. Galette and Wilson are better suited for a 3-4 than a 4-3. Most scouts tend to think that their personnal is best suited for the scheme change.

If you look at the other side, there are holes also. If you go 2-gap, who is your big space eating NT? Galette and Wilson have the talent and measurables but are unproven pass rushers. Lofton has never played in a 3-4 and isn't exactly a great coverage player.

The type of coordinator we hire will determine if we run a one-gap or two-gap 3-4. For example: Anyone from the Belicheck tree will probably run a two-gap scheme (Mangini & Crennel).

I'd be nice if a football discussion could be had without personal insults. If anyone wishes to talk about the benefits of a 3-4 and a 4-3 with our current personnel and which 3-4 scheme suits us best (one-gap or two-gap) then lets do it - we could do the same for the Falcons.

Bunkley wasn't with the Broncos when they were a 3-4. Because they switched to a 4-3 after 2010 while Bunkley was there only during the 2011 season.

#124 Saintsfan#1

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:54 PM

Saints need to get John Jenkins and put him at NT if he's on board at 15

Jordan/Jenkins/Hicks

#125 CaliSaint4Life

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:54 PM

View PostDawnOfThemBirds, on 25 January 2013 - 03:50 PM, said:

Bunkley wasn't with the Broncos when they were a 3-4. Because they switched to a 4-3 after 2010 while Bunkley was there only during the 2011 season.
You right, and that was a mistype by me. That was suppose to be 4-3 (I'll make the change). My point is, he was one of the best, if not the best 1-tech in the NFL that year.

#126 SuperSK

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:55 PM

View PostDawnOfThemBirds, on 25 January 2013 - 03:50 PM, said:

Bunkley wasn't with the Broncos when they were a 3-4. Because they switched to a 4-3 after 2010 while Bunkley was there only during the 2011 season.
Former Eagle Bunkley is elite in Broncos' 3-4 'D'
Recommend Comment(9) Facebook

Thanks to a new role as a nose tackle in a 3-4 defensive front, Brodrick Bunkley has turned into an elite player in Denver. (US Presswire)
COREY SEIDMAN

On Saturday we looked at Derek Landri, Pro Football Focus’ fourth-ranked defensive/nose tackle out of 87 NFL qualifiers at his position (see story). Landri had a plus-22.0 grade in just one-third of the Eagles’ defensive snaps. A familiar face occupied the spot ahead of Landri. Brodrick Bunkley (plus-24.1) was ranked third.

The Eagles traded Bunkley to the Cleveland Browns last July 30 several hours after signing free agent defensive lineman Cullen Jenkins. Bunkley refused to go to Cleveland, however, and the trade was rescinded two days after crossing the league’s official trading wire....

The Broncos made Bunkley their 3-4 nose tackle at the beginning of the season and he instantly thrived.

The Florida State product had three stops – plays he ended alone -- in Denver’s season-opener against the Raiders and never quit stuffing the run. Bunkley for the year had 32 stops in 485 snaps. No other defensive tackle with fewer than 500 snaps had as many as 23.

Bunkley's penchant for ending plays by himself earned him a plus-28.4 grade in the ground game and the No. 1 overall ranking among defensive tackles against the run.

Pro Football Focus called Bunkley a “player to watch for” in Sunday’s wild card playoff matchup with the Steelers, won 29-23 on an 80-yard touchdown pass from Tim Tebow to Demaryius Thomas on the first play of overtime.

Sure enough, Bunkley made an impact for the Broncos late in the game. With Denver up 23-16 and 7:35 to play, Bunkley sacked Ben Roethlisberger on first down at the Pittsburgh 45-yard line. The Steelers would eventually score, but stopping Roethlisberger six yards behind the line of scrimmage ran off precious seconds the team wouldn’t get back in a potential game-winning drive at the end of the quarter.

A developing nose tackle who has made the most of his opportunities on the field in Denver, Bunkley appears to have found his NFL calling. It only took six years, a change of scenery and a new defensive system. Some players are simply better built for the 3-4.

Former Eagle Bunkley is elite in Broncos' 3-4 'D'

#127 SuperSK

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:56 PM

View PostSaintsfan#1, on 25 January 2013 - 03:54 PM, said:

Saints need to get John Jenkins and put him at NT if he's on board at 15

Jordan/Jenkins/Hicks
a little bit of a reach at 15, dont you think. Id still rather get an OLB like Jordan or Mingo.

#128 CaliSaint4Life

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:00 PM

View PostSuperSK, on 25 January 2013 - 03:55 PM, said:

Former Eagle Bunkley is elite in Broncos' 3-4 'D'
Recommend Comment(9) Facebook

Thanks to a new role as a nose tackle in a 3-4 defensive front, Brodrick Bunkley has turned into an elite player in Denver. (US Presswire)
COREY SEIDMAN

On Saturday we looked at Derek Landri, Pro Football Focus’ fourth-ranked defensive/nose tackle out of 87 NFL qualifiers at his position (see story). Landri had a plus-22.0 grade in just one-third of the Eagles’ defensive snaps. A familiar face occupied the spot ahead of Landri. Brodrick Bunkley (plus-24.1) was ranked third.

The Eagles traded Bunkley to the Cleveland Browns last July 30 several hours after signing free agent defensive lineman Cullen Jenkins. Bunkley refused to go to Cleveland, however, and the trade was rescinded two days after crossing the league’s official trading wire....

The Broncos made Bunkley their 3-4 nose tackle at the beginning of the season and he instantly thrived.

The Florida State product had three stops – plays he ended alone -- in Denver’s season-opener against the Raiders and never quit stuffing the run. Bunkley for the year had 32 stops in 485 snaps. No other defensive tackle with fewer than 500 snaps had as many as 23.

Bunkley's penchant for ending plays by himself earned him a plus-28.4 grade in the ground game and the No. 1 overall ranking among defensive tackles against the run.

Pro Football Focus called Bunkley a “player to watch for” in Sunday’s wild card playoff matchup with the Steelers, won 29-23 on an 80-yard touchdown pass from Tim Tebow to Demaryius Thomas on the first play of overtime.

Sure enough, Bunkley made an impact for the Broncos late in the game. With Denver up 23-16 and 7:35 to play, Bunkley sacked Ben Roethlisberger on first down at the Pittsburgh 45-yard line. The Steelers would eventually score, but stopping Roethlisberger six yards behind the line of scrimmage ran off precious seconds the team wouldn’t get back in a potential game-winning drive at the end of the quarter.

A developing nose tackle who has made the most of his opportunities on the field in Denver, Bunkley appears to have found his NFL calling. It only took six years, a change of scenery and a new defensive system. Some players are simply better built for the 3-4.

Former Eagle Bunkley is elite in Broncos' 3-4 'D'
I thought the Broncos were multiple that year. I watched tape of him when we signed him and I saw him at 0-tech and shaded nose. Also, their DC (Dennis Allen) runs a base 4-3.

#129 D.O.T.B.☑

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:00 PM

View PostSuperSK, on 25 January 2013 - 03:55 PM, said:

Former Eagle Bunkley is elite in Broncos' 3-4 'D'
Recommend Comment(9) Facebook

Thanks to a new role as a nose tackle in a 3-4 defensive front, Brodrick Bunkley has turned into an elite player in Denver. (US Presswire)
COREY SEIDMAN

On Saturday we looked at Derek Landri, Pro Football Focus’ fourth-ranked defensive/nose tackle out of 87 NFL qualifiers at his position (see story). Landri had a plus-22.0 grade in just one-third of the Eagles’ defensive snaps. A familiar face occupied the spot ahead of Landri. Brodrick Bunkley (plus-24.1) was ranked third.

The Eagles traded Bunkley to the Cleveland Browns last July 30 several hours after signing free agent defensive lineman Cullen Jenkins. Bunkley refused to go to Cleveland, however, and the trade was rescinded two days after crossing the league’s official trading wire....

The Broncos made Bunkley their 3-4 nose tackle at the beginning of the season and he instantly thrived.

The Florida State product had three stops – plays he ended alone -- in Denver’s season-opener against the Raiders and never quit stuffing the run. Bunkley for the year had 32 stops in 485 snaps. No other defensive tackle with fewer than 500 snaps had as many as 23.

Bunkley's penchant for ending plays by himself earned him a plus-28.4 grade in the ground game and the No. 1 overall ranking among defensive tackles against the run.

Pro Football Focus called Bunkley a “player to watch for” in Sunday’s wild card playoff matchup with the Steelers, won 29-23 on an 80-yard touchdown pass from Tim Tebow to Demaryius Thomas on the first play of overtime.

Sure enough, Bunkley made an impact for the Broncos late in the game. With Denver up 23-16 and 7:35 to play, Bunkley sacked Ben Roethlisberger on first down at the Pittsburgh 45-yard line. The Steelers would eventually score, but stopping Roethlisberger six yards behind the line of scrimmage ran off precious seconds the team wouldn’t get back in a potential game-winning drive at the end of the quarter.

A developing nose tackle who has made the most of his opportunities on the field in Denver, Bunkley appears to have found his NFL calling. It only took six years, a change of scenery and a new defensive system. Some players are simply better built for the 3-4.

Former Eagle Bunkley is elite in Broncos' 3-4 'D'


How is that when Fox switched to a 4-3 in 2011 because he was a 4-3 guy?

Miller has not played 3-4 OLB with them but is used as an edge rusher on most passing downs.


Here is a link:http://www.denverpos...cos/ci_17418393

Edited by DawnOfThemBirds, 25 January 2013 - 04:05 PM.


#130 Saintsfan#1

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:02 PM

View PostSuperSK, on 25 January 2013 - 03:56 PM, said:

a little bit of a reach at 15, dont you think. Id still rather get an OLB like Jordan or Mingo.

no, that's about where he should be taken and Bunkley is not the answer at NT

#131 A Pimp Named Slickback™

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:10 PM

Good to see some actual football being discussed.

#132 D.O.T.B.☑

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:14 PM

View PostSuperSK, on 25 January 2013 - 03:56 PM, said:

a little bit of a reach at 15, dont you think. Id still rather get an OLB like Jordan or Mingo.

I think that Jordan needs to get both bigger and stronger because even though he is tall, he is lanky for his size and relies on his speed to beat OTs.

#133 CaliSaint4Life

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:26 PM

View PostDawnOfThemBirds, on 25 January 2013 - 04:14 PM, said:

I think that Jordan needs to get both bigger and stronger because even though he is tall, he is lanky for his size and relies on his speed to beat OTs.
Yeah, but that body will fill out. Also, I think he may be more of a LBer than a DE. Think of him in sort of a Von Miller role (without being an alien).

#134 SuperSK

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:27 PM

View PostDawnOfThemBirds, on 25 January 2013 - 04:14 PM, said:

I think that Jordan needs to get both bigger and stronger because even though he is tall, he is lanky for his size and relies on his speed to beat OTs.

He does need to get bigger. He has the frame to grow also without hurting his speed too much.

View PostSaintsfan#1, on 25 January 2013 - 04:02 PM, said:

no, that's about where he should be taken and Bunkley is not the answer at NT


As a 2 gap NT, I completely agree. In a 1 tech though,  I think he can do it. Also, I like Jenkins as a 1st rd pick, I just dont seeh im in the top 20

View PostDawnOfThemBirds, on 25 January 2013 - 04:00 PM, said:

How is that when Fox switched to a 4-3 in 2011 because he was a 4-3 guy?

Miller has not played 3-4 OLB with them but is used as an edge rusher on most passing downs.


Here is a link:http://www.denverpos...cos/ci_17418393

I honestly dont know which one is right. I found that article on SR and it shows him as a 34 NT.

#135 vel

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 06:11 PM

Wow. It took Saints fans to bring football discussion back to this board. I appreciate it but it's a shame. Can't even accept the good team we have and discuss ways to make it better but we can talk about the Saints? Thanks Saints fans for at least being polite.

#136 Kevo

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 07:21 PM

View PostThe Chunk, on 25 January 2013 - 05:42 AM, said:



Lost season? We had the best record in the NFL sweetheart! And yes, your welfare dependant fan base will have to settle for a tainted championship. Sole fact YOUR TEAM, AND COACHES CHEATED! Nothing can erase that champ........chump
And just what did the best record in the NFL get you??? Home for the Super Bowl...that's what.

#137 SoHonest

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 07:34 PM

The real is Back 2013 ... WHO DAT BACK!!!!!!!!!!!! On the topic of the thread it is a shame how you guys glorify simply making the playoffs in New Orleans its SUPER BOWL or Bust. And that is the problem with your fan base your standards are low Matt Ryan is not a elite QB and in a season where the Panthers and Bucs took a step back you did not FINISH the job with home field again. Hope u enjoyed the playoffs LOL...... Oh yea  Keep typing Ain'ts........ because we HAVE A LOMBARDI SOMETHING U AIN'T GOT!!!!!!!!!!! WHO DAT BACK

Edited by SoHonest, 25 January 2013 - 07:35 PM.


#138 vel

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 09:39 PM

That was short lived...

#139 Tuggle'14

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 09:47 PM

View PostSoHonest, on 25 January 2013 - 07:34 PM, said:

.... Oh yea  Keep typing Ain'ts........ because we HAVE A ASTERISK* SOMETHING U AIN'T GOT!!!!!!!!!!! WHO DAT BACK

Fixed it for you. Posted Image

Seriously , this was a decent thread to read till this goober showed up.

#140 SuperSK

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:19 PM

View Postvel, on 25 January 2013 - 09:39 PM, said:

That was short lived...
I figured it was coming. Lol